Proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on
Official Languages
Issue No. 4 - Evidence - Meeting of May 9, 2016
OTTAWA, Monday, May 9, 2016
The Standing Senate Committee on Official Languages met this day at 5:32 p.m. to continue its study on the application of the Official Languages Act and of the regulations and directives made under it, within those institutions subject to the act.
Senator Claudette Tardif (Chair) in the chair.
[Translation]
The Chair: Good evening. My name is Claudette Tardif, and I am a senator from Alberta. I have the pleasure of chairing the meeting this evening. Before giving our witness the floor, I would invite the members of the committee to introduce themselves.
Senator McIntyre: Paul McIntyre from New Brunswick.
Senator Gagné: Senator Raymonde Gagné from Manitoba.
Senator Poirier: Senator Rose-May Poirier from New Brunswick.
Senator Seidman: Senator Judith Seidman from Quebec.
Senator Rivard: Senator Michel Rivard from Quebec.
Senator Jaffer: Senator Mobina Jaffer from British Columbia.
The Chair: The Standing Senate Committee on Official Languages is interested in post-secondary institutions in francophone Canada. This evening, we are pleased to welcome Lynn Brouillette, Acting Director of the Association des collèges et universités de la francophonie canadienne. This association was created on April 1, 2015, by the merger of two organizations: the Consortium national de formation en santé and the Association des universités de la francophonie canadienne. Ms. Brouillette, thank you for agreeing to appear before our committee. The senators will have questions for you after your presentation. I now invite you to make your presentation.
Lynn Brouillette, Acting Director General, Association des collèges et universités de la francophonie canadienne: Good evening Madam Chair and members of the committee. On behalf of the board of directors of the Association des collèges et universités de la francophonie canadienne, the ACUFC, I would like to thank you for the invitation to share our comments with you about your current study concerning the application of the Official Languages Act.
If I may, I would first like to introduce the association and describe its contribution to promoting the Canadian francophone community and the official languages. I will also make the connection between that contribution and the subject of the committee's study.
As was noted a moment ago, the ACUFC was created on April 1, 2015, by the merger of the Consortium national de formation en santé, the CNFS, and the Association des universités de la francophonie canadienne, two organizations that are recognized for their many initiatives in relation to post-secondary education in French over the last 15 years.
The ACUFC is a unique model of inter-institutional, interprovincial and federal-provincial collaboration. Its membership consists of 21 francophone or bilingual colleges and universities that offer over 900 programs of study in French, have more than 42,600 students and produce nearly 10,000 graduates a year.
The ACUFC is intended to be the strong and collective voice of these colleges and universities, which are located in minority francophone communities throughout Canada outside Quebec. Its aim is to expand access to post-secondary education in French, and also to enhance the vitality of francophone Canada and promote the francophone community within Canadian society as a whole.
I would first like to talk about two of the major focuses of the ACUFC's activities: education in health care professions, through the CNFS, and education in justice professions, through the Réseau national de formation en justice.
As you know, access to health and justice in French is an additional challenge for minority francophone communities. In both of these fields, recipients of services are vulnerable, and the language barrier exacerbates their situation. It is therefore crucial to increase the number of professionals who are able to offer services in both official languages in these two fields.
The membership of the CNFS consists of 11 of the 21 member institutions of the ACUFC. Since 2003, the CNFS has supported about 100 programs in the field of health, including the creation of 68 new programs, and this has made possible the training of more than 6,700 professionals able to offer health services in French.
The most recent analysis of the placement of our graduates shows that 94 per cent of them are, in fact, working in health care in minority francophone communities and 91 per cent are working in their province of origin. We can therefore say that we are having a direct impact on the well-being and sustainable development of those communities.
The activities of the CNFS are funded by Health Canada, through its Official Language Community Development Bureau, the OLCDB, working under the Roadmap for Canada's Official Languages 2013-2018: Education, Immigration, Communities. I would like to note the wonderful support from the OLCDB, which has been an instrumental ally since the creation of the CNFS.
In our view, the OLCDB is a positive measure and one of the best practices that the department has for meeting its official languages obligations. However, we are very concerned about the future of the OLCDB at Health Canada, since the executive director position has been vacant for six months and no hiring process has yet been initiated. We would like to be consulted in order to avoid an administrative decision being made by the department that might have an extremely negative impact on our communities.
The Réseau national de formation en justice was created two years ago and is essentially intended to expand the capacity of the justice system in Canada, and thus facilitate access to justice in both official languages. Nine of the member establishments of the ACUFC belong to it.
The national secretariat of the ACUFC handles administration and coordination of the network's activities, which are made possible by the financial support of Justice Canada, under the current roadmap. To expand access to justice in both official languages in a tangible way, the number of graduates of post-secondary programs in law and the number of participants enrolled in on-the-job training programs would need to be substantially increased. There would also have to be improvement in the availability of legal and jurilinguistic tools for jurilinguists, justice professionals and litigants. Greater investment by the federal government is therefore essential if this is to be achieved.
These activities, in both health care and justice, cannot be separated from the application of the Official Languages Act and the roadmap, which give federal departments the necessary financial latitude for applying the act.
In addition to contributing to direct services to the public, the activities of the CNFS and the network within the ACUFC also contribute to the vitality and development of the minority francophone communities. In this regard, I would draw a parallel with Part VII of the Official Languages Act, which provides that the act and the regulations made under it must contribute to the vitality of the minority language communities. We must never lose sight of that aspect of the act.
I will now try to illustrate how the ACUFC plays an essential role in the vitality of Canada's francophone communities.
The member institutions of the ACUFC are pillars of their communities and contribute both to the development of human capital and to the cultural and economic success of these communities and Canada as a whole. In addition to training the workforce of tomorrow, the colleges and universities of francophone Canada will secure the future of the official languages and Canadian identity, the vitality and resilience of the communities and, ultimately, the prosperity of our country.
Our institutions operate in regions where English predominates. They offer talented young people from all over a valuable opportunity to obtain an excellent education in French, and at the same time give them the chance to improve their English in their host community.
For young people who come from minority francophone communities, it is important to have access to a true continuum of education in French, from early childhood to the post-secondary level. The ACUFC seeks to be the final chain in that continuum, but the first defender of post-secondary education in French in Canada.
Our mission in serving minority francophone communities is to offer excellent educational programs in French, not only to native-born francophones, but also to young francophile and/or bilingual anglophones. Our colleges and universities are therefore front-line actors in the effort to strengthen Canada's linguistic duality as a fundamental value and open up an entire world of possibilities to young Canadians.
As commissioner Graham Fraser recommended in his testimony to your committee at about the same time last year, our educational institutions need the support of the federal government to continue improving and expanding learning opportunities for their target populations. That support is essential for the following reasons.
First, we need to help our colleges and universities continue the post-secondary programming they offer, which has expanded considerably in the last 12 years but still only amounts to about 7 per cent of the post-secondary programs offered in French outside Quebec, in the case of health care. Second, we have to strengthen their capacity to offer more programs in French and implement new initiatives, tailored to the needs of their student populations, which are increasingly varied. Third, we have to put in place the infrastructure that is needed in order to admit more graduates of French immersion programs, immigrants and international students.
In fact, your committee's report on bilingualism among Canadian youth, which you tabled in June 2015, was very clear and eloquent on the subject of the essential role played by the federal government. Moreover, one of your recommendations called on the government, through Canadian Heritage, and I quote, to:
. . .acknowledge the importance of continued language learning after secondary school by helping colleges and universities develop more official-language programs and by allocating the necessary resources to them.
Along the same line, French immersion at the post-secondary level carries enormous potential for francophone communities. While almost 380,000 young Canadians are enrolled in immersion programs at the elementary and secondary levels, ACUFC members at present have only about 4,600 students from those immersion programs. This further highlights the importance of the role and support of the federal government in implementing the measures and the enhanced programming that are needed in order to attract that student population and meet their needs.
In closing, I can assure you that the ACUFC member institutions have adapted to the new demolinguistic facts of life in francophone Canada and are, today, a mirror of its diversity. Our student body also includes young people from exogamous marriages or immigrant families, immersion graduates and international students who have French as their first or second language.
We also believe it is useful to go beyond quantitative measurements and look at the vitality of francophone communities, including the vitality of their institutions, such as post-secondary educational institutions. The institutional vitality criterion is more relevant than ever, and it will promote more coherent linkages between Part IV and Part VII of the Official Languages Act. It should therefore be reflected in the regulations made under the act.
We, as Canadians, distinguish ourselves by our linguistic competencies, and the post-secondary educational institutions that are members of the ACUFC are proud to contribute to this.
Thank you for your attention. I will be pleased to answer your questions.
The Chair: Thank you very much, Ms. Brouillette, for your excellent presentation. I would invite Senator Poirier to ask the first question. She is the deputy chair of the committee.
Senator Poirier: Welcome, Ms. Brouillette. I have a few questions to begin. As you said at the beginning of your presentation, the colleges and universities and all francophone universities outside Quebec formed this organization a year ago. Can you explain to the committee what benefits you have been able to gain from doing this?
Ms. Brouillette: Thank you for your question. This is a development that was brought about over time. Within the consortium, the colleges and universities group worked together to offer a better range of programs in the field of health care, and, in addition, there were all the francophone universities outside Quebec.
Over time, we realized that these two groups had a lot in common, particularly that they were working in the minority francophone communities. This was the origin of the idea to unite the two boards of directors. In addition, six members of the boards of directors belonged to both groups. Then, a few years ago, the board of directors put forward the idea of joining forces, with the ultimate goal of strengthening their voices concerning francophone post-secondary education outside Quebec.
The association now includes all of the francophone colleges and universities outside Quebec, throughout Canada. This enables us to position ourselves better for working on common challenges.
Senator Poirier: In your presentation, you also mentioned the percentage of graduates who are working in their own province or who have found employment after graduating.
My question is more specifically about the context of the minority francophone communities in rural areas; those communities often have difficulty attracting workers in health care, education, and other fields. Is there a network that could help these rural communities offer their young people their first job in their field?
Ms. Brouillette: The whole question of serving rural communities, or underserved communities, and even communities where there is no francophone college or university, is an issue that we have been working on for some time now. The Consortium national de formation en santé believes this is the most important issue within the ACUFC.
We have always had regional partners that enabled us to go to areas where there was no college or university. For example, in Yukon or the Northwest Territories, and in Nunavut and Saskatchewan, at present, there is no francophone post-secondary programming in health care. There are also underserved rural areas in Newfoundland and British Columbia, as you say, and even in the provinces where there are colleges and universities.
In recent years, we have carried out special projects to work with key actors in those regions, to encourage graduates to return to them. For example, when someone comes from Saskatchewan, we have incentives to encourage that person to go back to their province.
At the post-secondary level, there are obviously a more limited number of programs offered in French than in English. People often have to leave their province to receive an education in French, and that involves additional costs for them. Another problem that sometimes arises is when people meet someone they want to spend their life with and then they may not return to their community, whether it is rural or remote. That often happens.
We have therefore put incentives in place to ensure that people go back to practise in their community, and that is where we get our statistic that 91 per cent of our graduates practise in their home province. That is the highest figure we have achieved to date. When we started to collect statistics, a decade ago, the percentage was already 86 per cent. The rate has risen since then, because we have more incentives available for people to go back to work in their community.
Senator Poirier: You say that 91 per cent of people go back to their province; is the highest proportion of these people found in urban areas or the rural areas of the province?
Ms. Brouillette: We do not necessarily have statistics concerning the urban and rural proportions. It often depends on the needs and the demand in the market in those regions. Certainly, the picture is different from one region of the country to another. I could not give you any more details on that subject. However, when we say that our graduates work in minority francophone communities, these are often rural communities or remote regions.
Senator Poirier: My final question is about immigration. You spoke a little about that, particularly in terms of integrating newcomers. A number of newcomers have found themselves in this situation recently.
Can you explain some more about what your role was in relation to Canadian colleges and educational institutions? Do you think it is essential that newcomers be able to communicate in French or English, to live in Canadian society?
Ms. Brouillette: In terms of immigration, this is certainly an issue in which we take a keen interest, and we work in collaboration with other partners who also have an interest in it.
Our universities and colleges are prepared to admit immigrants. The challenge that has arisen in recent years, and this will be nothing new to you, has been to attract francophone immigrants to the communities where our colleges and universities are located. The institutions would like to admit them, and, in most cases, structures have been put in place to assist immigrants.
We have successfully admitted immigrants over the years, but attracting immigrants to our communities is not necessary an easy thing. We work with partners like the Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada and other organizations to encourage immigrants to attend our institutions.
Senator Poirier: Do you think it is important for immigrants to have some knowledge of one of the two official languages, to live in Canadian society?
Ms. Brouillette: Yes, it is very important. Our network of colleges and universities is prepared to offer both post- secondary education and continuing education or language courses. Most of our institutions offer various language courses to support immigrants and other student groups who have French as a second language.
Senator McIntyre: Thank you for your excellent presentation, Ms. Brouillette.
As you mentioned, your organization was created in 2015. I note that it is the product of the merger of two organizations and is composed of 21 post-secondary or bilingual educational institutions. That said, I understand that your organization devotes support specifically to post-secondary education in health care and justice. You also referred to this aspect in your presentation, at pages 2 and 3 of the French version. What are the main achievements of the Consortium national de formation en santé and the Réseau national de formation en justice in this regard?
Ms. Brouillette: I will start with the Consortium national de formation en santé, because there is, in fact, a history that dates back to 2003, while the Réseau national de formation en justice is more recent and has been in place for only two years.
The interesting fact about the consortium is that in 2003, there were about 40 programs offered in the field of health care. Now, with the support of Health Canada, under the roadmap, we have made significant investments and have put 68 programs in place. They represent an attractive range of programs, although they still account for only 7 per cent of the number of programs offered in English. In a study done in 2011, we made a comparison, to assign a ranking to the programs offered in health care in French, and the study showed that in 2011, those programs amounted to only 7 per cent of the programs offered in English.
The consortium's achievements are a result of various forms of collaboration on the projects we have all taken part in together. The consortium has used all possible forms of distance education and collaboration. It sometimes involved simply sharing materials with another educational institution so it could offer the program or developing a program jointly.
I can give you a few concrete examples. Université Sainte-Anne in Nova Scotia wanted to offer a social service program, but it might not have had the capacity to organize the university curriculum, so it partnered with Laurentian University. A social service program is offered by Laurentian University through distance education. The students can therefore stay in Nova Scotia, with a professor on site, and take the courses that are considered to be electives or non- major courses at Université Sainte-Anne. This allows for attachment and cohesion within the university, and students can live in their community and receive a diploma, and are then able to offer services within that community without having to leave the province.
Another example relates to colleges; four colleges partnered to develop a program and offer it jointly. The four colleges included two Ontario colleges, La Cité and Collège Boréal, which joined with the Collège communautaire du Nouveau-Brunswick and the college section of Université de Saint-Boniface. The four institutions joined forces to create a health services and community services management program together, so they could offer courses to a pool of students within Canada through distance education.
After being in existence for 13 years, when we talk about creating a new program within the consortium, it means developing a program to meet certain needs within or communities, but also from a Canada-wide perspective, because the local pools of students are often not sufficient to offer a program in only one location. We always have to consider the Canada-wide perspective.
That is why the support of the federal government is valuable; it enables us to operate this way, Canada-wide. It enables us to meet needs in the provinces, but taking that perspective into account.
Senator McIntyre: In your speaking notes, on page 7, you refer to the role of the federal government. From that, I would draw your attention to the federal government's next multi-year official languages plan. Would you have any recommendations to make to the federal government regarding the next multi-year plan that it is committed to developing?
In addition, what would the needs of francophone colleges and universities be for the next five years? How do you see all of this?
Ms. Brouillette: I would say that, in terms of recommendations, it is important not to lose sight of what has been built over the last 13 years.
I am referring to the consortium that has put 68 new programs in place. The money paid by the federal government works as a lever to ensure that all these programs are offered and to support them, because it brings in support from the provinces, whose funding is added to the federal government's. The provinces are still the entities that fund a majority of the costs associated with offering these programs. Given that this is an area under provincial jurisdiction, it is important that the provinces not withdraw funding. The federal government money has worked as a lever for establishing these 68 programs, in addition to the 40 existing programs, which now makes over 100.
We should recall that these programs often involve small cohorts of students; that is the reality for minority francophone communities. It means that if we did not receive money from the federal government, many of those programs would disappear. Over the last 13 years, we have built up valuable and important health care programming, to meet the needs of our francophone communities.
The first recommendation would therefore be to continue to support what has been established, because the timeline for creating the number of programs we are talking about here, 68 new programs, has been relatively short.
As a second recommendation, I would ask for continuing support for the consortium, which has proved itself in terms of efficiency and effectiveness. I can give you a very interesting report on all of the forms of collaboration that have led to the creation of these programs.
At present, we have initiated a process in which our 11 institutions have submitted letters of intent to propose more programs to be included in the next official languages action plan. It is worth noting the innovation and creativity in our institutions, and I think that at some point, when you are operating in a minority situation, you have to be creative and innovative. In the letters of intent, none of the institutions asked to create a program in its community for a pool of students located within its area. Once again, all of the letters of intent proposed some form of collaboration, such as, for example, a program offered through distance education, that was promoted in other provinces and among the partners, in specific and concrete ways. These were therefore programs developed in partnership in two or three different provinces. The programs are decentralized, materials are shared, and so on.
So that gives you an idea of the maturity we have achieved within the consortium, which has enabled us to really be champions of collaboration for creating programs. Without that collaboration, we would not have this range of programs to offer.
What we would like is to take the experience acquired in the case of health care education and transfer it to law, which will be important for the ACUFC. In fact, the members of the Réseau national de formation en justice are already telling us that in some respects, they have gained five years' experience as a result of what has been done in the consortium. We can build on this experience and incorporate it into our network, and we will then gain time in various regards for creating programming in the field of legal education.
Senator Jaffer: Thank you for your very interesting presentation. I have one question about immigration that follows up on Senator Poirier's question. You said that attracting immigrants to the program is a challenge. I would like to know why.
Ms. Brouillette: In fact, when I said a challenge, it is not to attract them to the programs, it is to attract francophone immigrants to our communities. Obviously, our colleges and universities mirror our minority francophone communities. They are located in urban areas or in remote or rural areas.
The challenge relates more, first, to attracting immigrants to those communities, and then to interesting them in our colleges and universities. That is what I meant when I said there was a challenge. However, our colleges and universities do want to attract immigrants, because that is an important clientele.
Senator Jaffer: I don't doubt that fact, and now I understand why the challenge exists.
I agree with you completely. The vitality of francophone communities is really important. I may be wrong, but I believe it is also important to attract immigrants who speak other languages and insist that they learn French.
In fact, how many students are in your programs who speak other languages?
Ms. Brouillette: I may not have that information, because the programming is offered entirely in French. All of our colleges and universities offer French-language programming. The programs are addressed to a number of clienteles that our colleges and universities want to admit and are already admitting, but to varying degrees. As I said, there are native-born francophones and students from immersion or French as a second language programs, and the latter groups represent a very significant clientele for our institutions, and also for strengthening the linguistic duality and the image of Canada.
What we want to be able to offer is an attractive continuum, both for native-born francophones and people who come to us from immersion programs and for people from immigrant families, or even international students. When we talk about a continuum, we are wanting to serve all these clienteles.
Senator Jaffer: As you know, I am from British Columbia.
[English]
When I speak to people of French-speaking origin, especially from Africa, one of their greatest challenges— I could be wrong and the chair will correct me — is that they are not, as of right, given French-speaking programs because they are not born in Canada of French-speaking parents. For me that is a real shame because these parents, especially, want to continue to have their children learn French and be part of the French community.
At the moment, B.C. has a vital French association run by people born outside of Canada. I'm sure you know of it.
Immigrants are very keen to learn the language. In B.C. there's a great demand for immersion, but the challenge is that they're not seen as francophone. I'm wondering how we can work to change that. We may not be able to change the Charter, and I understand that. How can we change that way of thinking where, to keep the vitality of the francophone community, we will need those people within the community?
[Translation]
Ms. Brouillette: I agree with your completely. These individuals enrich our communities, and clearly this enrichment is important to the communities.
In our colleges and universities, immigrants who speak French are always welcome. Sometimes, it is a challenge to know how to reach them and promote our programs to them. When the client population is within a community, it is relatively easy to do. However, in a larger community like Vancouver, it is more difficult to reach people. Our institutions are entirely prepared to admit students from these groups. In fact, two members of our association are in British Columbia, the Simon Fraser University Office of Francophone and Francophile Affairs and Collège Éducacentre.
The people you are talking about, who come from Africa or other countries, are a clientele of interest to the colleges and universities. That is why we want to have a more attractive range of programs to offer them.
Senator Rivard: Welcome, Ms. Brouillette. Thank you for your excellent presentation. Your presentation is so good that we are wondering what questions we could ask you. You have already answered all the questions we could put to you.
You know, of course, that this committee will be going to British Columbia in September, to meet with witnesses and francophone associations. Our goal is to report on the situation and make recommendations to the government.
My question relates specifically to certain issues that arise in British Columbia. We know that there are certain advantages for teachers to have basic French programs, intensive French programs or French immersion, and to have access to continuing education. You talked about Collège Éducacentre and Simon Fraser University. Do these institutions offer training for francophone teachers in British Columbia? The answer is yes. However, I would like to know whether the professors have access to scholarships for teaching. If they exist, do they come from private or public foundations, from the provincial or federal government, or from other sources? Are teachers entitled to scholarships? If so, where do they come from? In addition, do you have an idea of the approximate value of a scholarship that a teacher could obtain?
Ms. Brouillette: I do not believe I can answer those questions in detail. I know that our institutions offer scholarships in various fields. Among the 21 institutions that make up our association, it varies widely. It all depends on the field of study. Sometimes, generic scholarships may be offered to students, regardless of the field in which they are studying. It would be hard for me to answer these questions more directly. I'm sorry.
Senator Rivard: Over the years, the committee has heard from a number of people in other provinces where the problem was finding professors who would agree to leave a francophone province, whether Quebec or New Brunswick, to go and teach French as a second language or immersion in the western provinces. Because there is no incentive, those positions are of interest only to unmarried teachers or people with no children. They criticized the fact that no assistance was provided in this regard.
My last question is this, and I can already imagine the answer. The University of British Columbia, known as UBC, does not offer any courses in French. Is it strictly an anglophone institution?
Ms. Brouillette: That is what I understand also.
The Chair: If you have any other information about the questions asked by Senator Rivard, please do not hesitate to send it to our clerk.
Ms. Brouillette: We have made a note, thank you.
The Chair: I would also like to point out that the Senate has authorized a study of the challenges associated with access to French schools and immersion programs in British Columbia. However, we have to apply for a budget. The process for the committee to be able to travel to British Columbia has therefore not yet been entirely completed. We are still hoping that it will be possible.
Senator Gagné: Ms. Brouillette, I am very pleased to cross paths with you again. I am quite familiar with your association. I would like to wish you success in the years to come.
Ms. Brouillette: Thank you.
Senator Gagné: Recently, I had a chance to read a report by the parliamentary budget officer entitled Federal Spending on Postsecondary Education, which was published on May 5. Among other things, the report discusses four things. It analyses federal spending on postsecondary education in Canada. It also examines changes in the financial support provided for this field of activity over the last 10 years and attempts to analyze the effects of those investments. On page 28 of the report, there is also an analysis of recent government announcements. In the list, it mentions, for example, changes in the tax credit program, and it also talks about scholarships. It refers to investments in the Youth Employment Strategy and student co-op placements, where $73 million will be invested over four years.
The report also looks at research. According to one announcement, the intention is to support research through the granting councils with an additional $95 million per year. In addition, $2 billion over three years will be invested in a new postsecondary institutions strategic investment fund. The biggest challenge for the postsecondary institutions operating in our minority francophone communities is to have real access to these funds.
I would like to get your perspective on the role that the Association des collèges et universités de la francophonie canadienne could play to ensure that the institutions are able to get their fair share of what the government has announced.
Ms. Brouillette: I could tell you about our research. The ACUFC, like the CNFS, has a background in this area and brings together people with an interest in research to identify the determining issues. Important projects are decided at these meetings. Over the years, one of our strengths has been our ability to bring people together to target projects that interest us, and our institutions have submitted projects. Take the example of CIHR, the Canadian Institutes of Health Research. The success rate for access or obtaining funds, at CIHR, is 10 to 13 per cent. That average applies to the majority.
In the case of our institutions, the percentage is lower. In general, our institutions are smaller. They do not have the same research capacity. It is therefore more difficult to create projects that can be funded by large funding agencies like CIHR.
A few years ago, a useful positive measure was implemented at CIHR. This was a specific research program by and for minority official language communities. For administrative and financial reasons, a restructuring took place at CIHR that resulted in the elimination of that program, which was designed specifically for official language communities. That caused problems, because since then, our institutions have found it difficult to get a fair share of research funds.
We therefore filed a complaint against CIHR and we had the support of Commissioner Fraser, who found for us in that situation, because it is not sufficient simply to have access to the program; there must be equitable access to the research funds. Commissioner Fraser also reported on this in his investigation report.
The ACUFC's role in this is to bring our researchers together to see where we stand in terms of research on the ground, whatever our interests are, and to determine what might work by and for the official language communities, where research leads to the "co-construction" of knowledge, nurtures the communities and supports the development of services available for the well-being of our communities.
The ACUFC works in collaboration with CIHR; CIHR is the subject of the report of the Commissioner of Official Languages, who made three recommendations, advocating that CIHR take positive measures to ensure that the educational institutions in our communities at the college and university levels have access to research funds. We are working very closely with CIHR to assist it in responding to the three recommendations. Ultimately, that will help us obtain an equitable share for our institutions. I have answered you mainly in respect of research.
Senator Gagné: Ultimately, what you are saying is that you are at the mercy of the political will. When programs are developed in the area of support for postsecondary education in Canada — because the government does play an important role, even though this field is under provincial jurisdiction — do you think it would be worthwhile to examine the program through a francophone lense, so we can determine whether it can meet the needs of communities served by universities and colleges in francophone Canada? It would help us see whether that program passes the francophone eye test.
Ms. Brouillette: The francophone lens is a term we use. Whether within the CIHR or in the departments, it is important to always use that lens, both when changes are being made and when new programs are being created. For example, when the CIHR was reorganized, there may have been no one to hold up that lens, because a program was eliminated and that had a harmful effect. Five years later, we are hoping to put a positive measure back in place.
I have a concern about health Canada and its Official Language Community Support Program. I want someone in the department to use the francophone lens and make sure that when a restructuring happens, we do not lose a positive measure that worked very well over the years, and that achieved very worthwhile successes, with our support and the support of other beneficiaries. There has to be support across the department, so the burden of proof does not always fall on the communities, which then have to go to the departments and argue for financial support.
Positive measures like these have to be put in place and have to be maintained, to support the communities. What we also want is for the next Action Plan for Official Languages to act as the francophone lens in a variety of areas. We could adopt the good practices that have been established over the years, to expand and improve access to education, which is our ultimate objective.
Senator McIntyre: Ms. Brouillette, as you said, our educational institutions need federal government support. That said, postsecondary institutions in francophone Canada have received funding under the Roadmap for Canada's Official Languages. How were those funds granted? Were they distributed equitably among education in the fields of health care, law, language training for economic immigrants, support for instruction in the minority language, and second language learning? Does your organization have anything to say when it comes to distributing these funds?
Ms. Brouillette: That gives me a chance to talk to you precisely about the CNFS governance model. That is the one with the longest history, on which the ACUFC was built. What is worth noting is that distribution of funds is one of the recommendations we are making to Health Canada. However, around the table, the 11 colleges and universities that offer education in health care or that have the capacity to offer it have adopted measures for agreeing among themselves as to how to allocate funds.
What makes it a relatively unique model is that the allocation is decided based on capacity and needs. Over the years, we have adopted various mechanisms to help us make the allocation. Ultimately, offering programs in the field of health care was one of our recommendations to Health Canada for making the allocation. It made the job easier for the department and the government, because we had agreed among ourselves around the board of directors table as to how to allocate the money received from the funder, Health Canada.
We want to extend this governance model within the ACUFC in order to allocate all funds we receive in the same way. This is a very elegant governance model, which the Department of Justice of Canada has found very interesting. It has expressed interest in working with us, because we had already developed this fine model, under which we put the needs on the table, we evaluate the funding opportunities, and we decide together how to allocate the funds. This is work that we have done over time and it has had considerable success.
The Chair: Senator Jaffer, do you still want to ask a question?
Senator Jaffer: Yes. Thank you. In your presentation, on page 8, you say that the necessary infrastructure has to be created to admit more students from immersion and French as a second language programs, and more immigrant and international students.
Could you expand your thinking on that subject?
Ms. Brouillette: When we talk about infrastructure, we mean service infrastructure. The needs of the students we admit into our colleges and universities in minority communities — immigrant students, international students or immersion students — are different from the needs of the native-born francophone students, for example.
Over time, some of our institutions have created some of these services, because they have a fairly significant student population, and, because we always want students to succeed, they want to support them in achieving success. Over time, our institutions have developed substantial programs or services to support these students, but there is still a lot of work to do.
Earlier, I gave you statistics showing that nearly 380,000 young Canadians are enrolled in immersion programs, and our postsecondary institutions admit only a little more than 4,000. We could admit many more, and we want to do that, but programming has to be put in place that can motivate them to attend our institutions and continue along the continuum they embarked on when they enrolled in immersion programs in elementary and secondary school. In addition, we have to support them in this adventure, that is, we have to offer them guidance and special services to help them succeed in their studies.
[English]
Senator Jaffer: I come from a culture where we speak many languages. Languages should not divide people. I am sometimes frustrated here that we have English as the main language and then the Francophonie speak to each other and the language doesn't expand. I'm not being rude. There is a great thirst in British Columbia within the immigrant community, within the allophone community, to speak both languages. It's a great advantage for their children to be conversant in both languages.
What can federal politicians or the federal government do to grow the Francophonie speaking community? It's necessary, if we're going to be truly become bilingual, that we include everyone in learning to speak both languages. As an educator, what suggestions can you make?
[Translation]
Ms. Brouillette: Thank you for your question, which is very much on point. The network I represent, the Association des collèges et des universités, an organization of 21 postsecondary institutions in our communities, is part of the solution for expanding and opening up the communities.
With our wish to admit native-born francophones and also people who come from immersion programs, immigrants and international students, we want to have a pool in our communities and we want people to be part of our communities and enrich them. Our institutions are prepared to admit students from these various groups, to expand our communities. However, in general, these are smaller institutions, and, ultimately, we have to have the resources to create attractive programming.
We therefore have to improve access to postsecondary education. It will then become more attractive for students from the various groups to enrol in our institutions.
Senator Gagné: A decade ago, the idea of a national strategy for postsecondary education was put forward and there was even talk about seeing whether the allocation for postsecondary education should be included in the Canada Social Transfer. In terms of the social transfer, we know that the transfer to the provinces is done as a block. It is extremely difficult to know exactly what portions of the transfers are paid directly to minority postsecondary institutions in minority.
Do you think the question of a national strategy for postsecondary education in French in minority communities should be revived? That would make it possible to ensure that the money transferred to the provinces is actually put into developing programming in French.
Ms. Brouillette: Are you talking about the OLEP, the Official Languages in Education Program?
Senator Gagné: Yes. It is easier in some provinces than in others to identify the money that is paid directly for postsecondary education. There is the OLEP, but when it comes to the transfer, for the province, it is very difficult to identify the funds.
Ms. Brouillette: That is always a question that we ask ourselves, because we are familiar with the program, whether it is the OLEP or the Official Languages in Education Program and, I would add, in French. A good portion of those envelopes is dedicated to elementary, intermediate and secondary education, and a portion is paid toward postsecondary education. As you say, it is, in fact, difficult to determine what portion of the funds is getting to postsecondary education.
In general, our association believes that this is the role the federal government should play, because there is always some concern when money goes through the provinces. It is hard to know what portion of the envelope is getting to the institutions, and, when the funds come directly from the federal government, it is easier to keep a Canada-wide perspective and do the work with that in mind. It is that perspective that enables us to develop Canada-wide projects. We often say that our francophone minority communities are like an eleventh province outside Quebec. That enables us to better identify their needs and respond to them as an association and network of institutions that can meet the communities' access to education needs.
Does that answer your question?
Senator Gagné: Yes, thank you.
Senator Mockler: I would like to apologise for being late, first. Northwestern New Brunswick was covered in snow this morning. That did give me an opportunity to look at the documents I had in hand.
I would like to congratulate you on your new responsibilities and the synergy you had for creating the new association.
I am very familiar with the Société Santé en français and the story of how it came about, and we follow its work very closely. Access to health care and justice in French is an extra challenge. I observe this in what you have presented concerning francophone minority communities. Can you tell us more about this specific factor, so we can put ourselves in the picture in relation to both the new programs and the roadmap?
Ms. Brouillette: You are asking me to tell you more about vulnerability?
Senator Mockler: Yes, given that it is a constant challenge, even since the creation of the Société Santé en français.
Ms. Brouillette: The consortium is concerned with health, and now, the association is also concerned with justice. In fact, when people have health problems or problems with the justice system, it is easy to understand that they find themselves in a very vulnerable position. We have created a number of tools to demonstrate that in dealing with the justice system or with a health challenge, it is particularly important to be able to speak in one's first language. That is even truer when it comes to mental health and medical emergencies as a result of an accident, for example. We realized that the same situation exists in the field of justice, and that is why we want to develop more programs to train professionals who can offer services to the community.
In fact, we recently created an entire project for active offer of services. That is my baby, the entire question of active offer of services in French. We realized that you cannot teach in our network of postsecondary institutions the way you teach in the majority network. It has to be done differently, because professionals like doctors, nurses and occupational therapists have to be trained, even if they come from those communities.
It is still not easy to understand why there may not be active demand for services, why francophones in the communities do not request these services. We do know, and the research clearly shows, that they could obtain these services in their language, but they do not have the reflex to ask for them, because they do not want to be seen as lobbyists who want to get services, and want them right now. They are afraid of being ignored. It is not reasonable for a person to have to request health services in their language, and people do not expect to have to do that.
There are multiple factors that have been documented that explain why people in our communities do not ask for services in French, even though studies clearly show that they could benefit greatly from them. It has been proved that we find it easier to comply with a health care plan if it is explained to us in our language. It has been proved that we will take our medications correctly when we are given the instructions in our own language.
So these are two crucial areas where good service has to be offered, service that is high quality and safe. People have to be able to receive services in their language.
Senator Mockler: I think it will always be a challenge to understand why people do not request the services, but you explain it very well. Since the early 2000s, when the Société Santé en français was recognized, there has been some improvement; however, we must still be vigilant, and that is evidently the role you are going to play.
Now, what are the main achievements of the Consortium national de formation en santé? I am asking that you give me, in concrete terms, three factors that have enabled you to make progress on this service.
Ms. Brouillette: In the health care field, as I was saying earlier, our major achievement is creating 68 postsecondary programs over the last 13 years. That is a tour de force. We have created bachelor's, college and university programs. There are two-year or three-year programs, three-year or four-year university programs, and master's programs. Creating 68 new programs in 13 years is a tour de force.
We have achieved this tour de force through the synergy at work among the colleges and universities. In the case of the Consortium national de formation en santé, that really was one of the most important assets.
We wondered whether services in French were in fact being offered in our communities, and we have done surveys for several years now. In my presentation, I provided some statistical data. Of the graduates in health care who were surveyed over a period of six months to one year after graduation, 94 per cent have settled in a francophone community, where they are serving francophones. That is the kind of statistics we have. In recent years, the rate has been around 86 or 88 per cent.
Senator Rivard: I want to come back to your excellent presentation. On page 3, you criticize the fact that the Official Language Community Development Bureau, the OLCDB, still does not have a director, and has not had for six months. You suggest that the Minister of Health consult you on this subject. I understand that this is an appointment that must be made by the Minister of Health.
You talk about six months. If we go back in time, the election was called on August 2. From then on, there could be no more appointments. The election was held on October 19. So we are within the six months. I do not want to take the side of the previous government or the new government, but that is more or less the time required for going back to the drawing board.
I read recently that there are several hundred positions that have to be filled, either by departments or agencies or by what is called the Governor in Council, the Prime Minister's Office. I get the feeling that deadlines are being met.
Do you have any recommendations for the department when it comes time to fill a position or are you waiting for the Minister to decide? I assume that you are bringing pressure to bear for an appointment to be made.
Ms. Brouillette: Thank you for putting that question back on the table. We think this is an important concern. Based on the information we have, the position should at least have been posted. We would not necessarily recommend any particular individual, but we very much want a structure like the OLCDB, at Health Canada, to be able to stay, because it is a model that has worked very well over the years. We had an excellent partnership, one that did not shift the burden of proof or the burden of argument to the beneficiaries. Within the department, there was this office that could support the argument for offering services in French in francophone minority communities. We believe this is clearly a good practice and an eloquent example of a positive measure. In fact, we would like to see OLCDBs in all departments. That would mean that it would not always be the communities that would bear the burden of proving the reasons why they should be supported.
The Chair: For the people listening, can you remind us what the OLCDB is?
Ms. Brouillette: Yes, it is the Official Language Community Development Bureau, at Health Canada. We have been working with that bureau since 2003.
The Chair: Is that the only department that has this kind of organization, to provide it with the francophone lens?
Ms. Brouillette: To my knowledge, when it comes to the departments with which we interact, it is the only one. That is the best lens we could hope to have, because the OLCDB has helped us enormously over the years. It enabled us to focus our energy on doing our work and creating programs rather than having to develop arguments and debating with the departments. The people at the OLCDB were the ones within the department who carried the torch, the people who argued the need to support us. That then allowed us to use our energy and our resources to develop programs.
The Chair: Ms. Brouillette, on behalf of the members of the committee, I would like to sincerely thank you for taking the time to come and testify before our committee. I was personally involved, in 2003, in creating the Consortium national de formation en santé, and also the Association des universités de la francophonie canadienne. I am therefore pleased and proud to see your many successes over the years.
Congratulations to you and your team, and thank you again.
(The committee adjourned.)