Proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on
Legal and
Constitutional Affairs
Issue 53 - Evidence
OTTAWA, Wednesday, February 10, 1999
The Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs, to which was referred Bill C-57, to amend the Nunavut Act with respect to the Nunavut Court of Justice and to amend other Acts in consequence, met this day at 3:44 p.m. to give consideration to the bill.
Senator Lorna Milne (Chairman) in the Chair.
[English]
The Chairman: Honourable senators, continuing our study of Bill C-57, respecting the Nunavut Court of Justice, we have a number of witnesses before us this afternoon. We have with us as well an interpreter who will be helping with the presentations, and, thanks to Senator Moore, we have a small map of the Nunavut Territory, which may help everyone by providing an image of the territory that we are talking about.
Having said that, I welcome all of you, and I would ask you to please proceed in the order you prefer.
Ms Leena Evic-Twerdin, Policy and Programme Advisor, Nunavut Tunngavik Inc. (interpretation): Madam Chairman, honourable senators, I have the honour to introduce to you Ms Rebecca Williams, Assistant Deputy Minister for Nunavut Department of Justice, and Mr. Allan Maclure, Legal Counsel for Nunavut Tunngavik. I am pleased to be a part of a great team whose commitment to the successful implementation of the bill we are here to support has been accompanied by a tremendous amount of knowledge and vision. I am also here representing the Nunavut communities and our honourable elders.
First, I should like to express my gratitude for being given the opportunity to speak in my language. Thank you. I would also like to take this opportunity to commend the Office of the Interim Commissioner and the Nunavut Department of Justice for their joint efforts in this process, and the Nunavut Implementation Commission for having had the courage to be as creative as they are. We are implementing the model they have recommended.
I also wish to thank our interpreter, Ms Qitsualik-Tinsley. It is a privilege to have her provide this service for me.
A process such as this is far too great for me to speak only of my views. Therefore, it is with a general view of the people I serve through Nunavut Tunngavik that I will attempt to share some insights regarding Nunavut support for Bill C-57.
I work directly with many Inuit in Nunavut. Ms Williams and I had the pleasure of talking with our elders on matters related to Bill C-57 prior to coming down here. In that regard, I have their trust and authority to encourage you also to support the bill.
Nunavut Tunngavik Inc., or NTI, was established as an entity in 1993. NTI represents the Inuit of Nunavut, plays a leadership role, and promotes a prosperous and stable future for the well-being of the Inuit of Nunavut.
NTI is charged with the responsibility of implementing the Nunavut Land Claims Agreement. I have been privileged to work for NTI since its establishment in April 1993, with a one-year break in between. Since then, I have seen much development as a result of the implementation of the Nunavut land claims. The claims have contributed to the successful ownership of programs and services in Nunavut through various organizations, such as the Nunavut Wildlife Management Board, the Nunavut Impact Review Board, the Nunavut Planning Commission, the Nunavut Water Board, the Nunavut Surface Rights Tribunal, the Nunavut Heritage Trust, the Nunavut Social Development Council, the Nunavut Implementation Training Committee, the Nunavut Implementation Panel, regional wildlife organizations, hunting and trapping organizations, and the Nunavut Trust. The Nunavut Marine Council is the only body of the Nunavut Land Claims Agreement not established as yet.
The creation of Nunavut carries with it two important elements for us. The Inuit will have ownership over the management of their land and environment, and a new government will be established. The three signatories to the Nunavut political accord, the Government of Canada, the Government of the Northwest Territories, and the Nunavut Tunngavik, all have obligations under the Nunavut Land Claims Agreement.
As the people of Nunavut, we are now busier than bees in the planning and preparation of our new creation, the Nunavut government. It is challenging and exciting to see this process unfolding, a process that the Inuit of Nunavut had waited to see for many years. It gives us pride.
Before the establishment of Nunavut and the corresponding responsibility for it, I saw many Inuit who had no sense of direction. Since the establishment of, or creation of, Nunavut, I now see many Inuit having the vision to move forward. Their hope is echoed in their expression "We now have Nunavut." That tells me Nunavut is their vision, their future.
In the traditional life of the Inuit, the Inuit people of Nunavut managed their own lives and their own future. Today, we still have many Inuit who come from that world. They have the wisdom and knowledge of life without crisis. They have the knowledge of societal responsibility of others, with respect and care.
We do many things in Nunavut, such as developing programs, health and wellness initiatives, healing and suicide prevention training, to name but a few. We have had to come along with these types of initiatives because, somewhere in the midst of being controlled by government programs and services, many Inuit had lost their sense of well-being.
Knowing who we are and having the wisdom to use effective teaching and learning techniques, we came to the realization that many of our people were lost. Many lives suffered as a consequence of that disempowerment. It was usual to hear that the Inuit had the highest rates of suicide and other social problems. Today, however, we are in the process of reclaiming our identity and our ways. It is because of the creation of Nunavut that this opportunity is becoming a reality. Nunavut is that opportunity and everything that falls under its establishment is a chance for positive impact on the future of the Inuit.
The successful passage of Bill C-57 will mean a better system for Nunavut and its people. The model of the court structure Nunavut is proposing will provide more ownership to communities through more responsibilities for the justice of the peace, training for the JPs, Nunavut judges residing within the settlement area, and a simpler administrative system that will have an impact on our communities.
Our successful working relationship with your officials and officials from the Government of the Northwest Territories on the whole process of the Nunavut Act amendments has brought us this far, and now we anticipate your support for the passage of Bill C-57 so that we may experience the whole process to its final stage.
We realize that the bill is specific and supports only a small thing, but to us it is an integral part of the larger puzzle that Nunavut Inuit envision for the future.
I will now pass you over to Alan Maclure.
Mr. Allan Maclure, Legal Counsel, Nunavut Tunngavik Inc.: Honourable senators, as you know, Bill C-57 contains the necessary legislative provisions to create a single level trial court for Nunavut. We appear today with Rebecca Williams from the Nunavut Department of Justice. I should like to say at the outset that we have a good working relationship with that department. As you will hear from Ms Williams, Deputy Minister Nora Sanders could not be with us today.
Ms Evic-Twerdin has provided you with a history of NTI and its mandates and I do not propose to add to that submission. I will, however, tell you of the role played by NTI in supporting the initiative tht brings this bill before you today.
This bill is the result of extensive consultation and review. Lawyers and staff of the federal Department of Justice, the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs, the Nunavut Department of Justice, the Department of Justice of the Northwest Territories, and NTI, have together over the course of many months worked cooperatively toward this result.
There has been a series of teleconferences and exchanges of draft legislation by way of e-mail as well as a face-to-face meeting that took place in the autumn of 1988. In these sessions, draft legislation was studied and discussed, quite literally on a line-by-line basis. This legislative working group, of which I had the privilege to be part, was motivated by a strong commitment to the future of the Nunavut justice system.
NTI found this process to be a very thoughtful and productive exercise. It has been very much Nunavut focused. We believe that this worthwhile exercise will result, if the bill is passed, in something very beneficial to the people of Nunavut and the administration of justice in Nunavut. NTI is pleased and proud to support this bill in its entirety.
The legislative changes that are contemplated in this bill include changes to federal legislation such as the Nunavut Act, the Criminal Code, the Young Offenders Act, and many other federal statutes. At the territorial level, the Judicature Act and the Justices of the Peace Act were reviewed and replaced. Other territorial statutes affected by the creation of the new court, as wide and varied as the Family Law Act, the Motor Vehicle Act, and the Residential Tenancies Act, to name but a few, were amended. The territorial legislative initiatives were included in a bill called the Nunavut Judicial System Implementations Act, which was passed in Yellowknife late in 1988.
A brief statement explaining the rationale for the creation of a single-level trial court for Nunavut is provided in the summary of the bill found in the first pages of the legislation before you. We recommend this section to you as providing an accurate statement of the reasons this project makes sense for Nunavut. We believe that the single-level trial court will provide many benefits for the people of Nunavut. It will unify the system of justice and perhaps lessen confusion for people who are not well versed in the reasons for a two-tiered court system and the respective jurisdictions of each of the courts.
We believe that, by virtue of this simpler structure, the justice system will be more accessible to the people of Nunavut. Over time, it is anticipated that there will be an enhanced role, at the local level, for justices of the peace.
We believe that this court system will allow the court to deal with all matters that may be pending in a community. In the present system, the supreme and territorial courts travel on different circuits, with the territorial court being unable to deal with matters that are properly within the jurisdiction of the supreme court. On the face of it, this legislation maintains the substantive and procedural rights of individual litigants and those who might be brought before the court.
Nunavut is embarking upon something truly unique in Canadian history. We understand that the federal and Nunavut departments of justice will be monitoring very closely the evolution of the judicial system. Doubtless, the practising members of the bar will be doing so as well.
I believe it was Mr. Bebbington of the Criminal Law Policy Section of the Department of Justice who raised within the working group the idea of the Government of Nunavut, NTI, the federal Department of Justice, and other stakeholders such as the bar, DIAND, and perhaps the judiciary, coming together, perhaps in 2001, to review matters relating to the administration of justice within Nunavut. We at NTI think that that is a very good idea, and we are not surprised by it. It is just another example of the commitment and shared responsibility of all the parties that had a hand in creating this bill.
In closing, honourable senators, we recommend Bill C-57 as drafted. We submit that the bill achieves the changes necessary to create a judicial system for Nunavut. It has a very good chance of being responsive to the needs and aspirations of the people of Nunavut and all Canadians who may come before the court. We urge the committee to support the speedy passage of the bill.
Ms Rebecca Williams, Assistant Deputy Minister, Nunavut Department of Justice (interpretation): I wish to thank senators and all those with whom we are working on this committee for the opportunity to be here today to speak about Bill C-57 and the Nunavut Court of Justice.
Honourable senators, I am grateful to be here with Leena Evic-Twerdin and Allan Maclure from Nunavut Tunngavik. Sadly, our Deputy Minister, Nora Sanders, is unable to be here today due to family illness. She has asked me to extend her regrets. Mr. James Posynick is present to answer any legal questions on behalf of our department.
The Inuit way is to speak from the heart and from one's own experience. I have worked with the justice system in the North since 1982, both with the territorial and N.W.T. superior courts and with the justices of the peace and probation and parole services. During those years, I have participated in the justice system and in the courts, working in such areas as criminal justice and child welfare. I was a social worker and a community justice specialist during that time, but I do not have the privilege of formal legal training.
As an Inuk, I do have the experience of observing myself, my relations, and the conditions of life and challenges that Inuit people are facing.
Because of my Inuit perspective, I feel it is very important to include in my presentation how valuable it has been that Inuit have contributed to the development of a court that makes sense to us and considers our needs and ways of life.
The initiative that has produced Bill C-57, which concerns our Nunavut Court of Justice, has included the Inuit at every stage. Because of this, our efforts have become like a pebble falling in water. Many rings of trust are growing in our communities. We Nunavumiut are trying to honour this trust and use it to move us forward. We believe we can include Inuit ideas, needs and contributions throughout the justice system in Nunavut.
Because of our work to date, I am able to advise you today about other wonderful projects that will improve the Nunavut justice system in which the Nunavut Court of Justice will function. The work we have done together in preparing for the Nunavut Court of Justice is very special to me. In my experience, it is the beginning of the real involvement of Inuit in determining the content of our own justice system. To help you understand this, I will explain some of the background about justice in Nunavut.
For many years, the justice system in our territory has been operating and impacting on us but not listening to us. There has been no way for the justice system to receive input from the Inuit. Many factors contributed to the silencing of Inuit in the operation of the justice system, but to explain that would take much longer than the time I have at my disposal today.
For us, the result has too often been silence in our communities; silence about social problems; silence about bad behaviour and people who are hurt; and silence about our own disputes and how to resolve them. Inuit did not know how to use the systems that were created for these things. The whole system operated outside our communities and our culture. In many of our communities, the justice system was treated as someone else's responsibility and someone else's problem. Even today, incarcerated persons, and even victims, often are taken away from us. At the same time, we see that our relations who have legal problems have too long a wait to get things resolved. Often, worse things happen while they are waiting.
We have been told that the combined number of federal and territorial inmates right now is approximately 200. We hear from the Correctional Services of Canada that we have now a higher rate of violent crime and a higher rate of imprisonment than elsewhere in Canada. We know that these people face conditions of overcrowding, often far from home, and that they are not healed. We see that very often they come back to us behaving worse than when they left.
In my experience, trying to implement policies designed without input from the Inuit does not work.
Next, I will talk about the process we used to develop the Nunavut Court of Justice. The process was revolutionary in our history because it involved Inuit. Inuit were able to express what kinds of system they needed to handle conflicts and to work for peace and for safe communities in the future. The process itself has given me hope about the future of our public government in Nunavut. I learned from this process ways of bringing our time of silence to an end.
In August of 1997, the Interim Commissioner of Nunavut, Jack Anawak, gave me the task of advising him about justice systems for Nunavut. We wanted a system that would make sense to all of the citizens of the new territory. Since that time, our values have been set out in a pamphlet about our vision for Nunavut. In its report, "Footprints 2," the Nunavut Implementation Commission expressed support in principle for the unification of the court systems in Nunavut as far as practicable.
I organized the meeting at which these very things we are discussing here today were first considered. That was the Consultation Meeting on Justice in Nunavut, which happened in Nunavut, November 18 to 19, 1997, in Iqaluit. Over 50 people participated. They included all kinds of workers in the current justice system -- persons with knowledge of court reform and other reform efforts elsewhere in Canada and, most important, many representatives of Inuit and persons with experience in Inuit social organizations. The meeting was facilitated by Tatiglit, who are people who own their own organization, and the title of our report was "Justice That Brings Peace."
It was amazing to me how, with cooperation and mutual respect, we were able to come to a consensus about the kind of court system that could meet the needs that all of us took to our meetings. Our conclusions were then conveyed to the Government of Canada and the governments of the territories, as well as Nunavut Tunngavik.
Also, I cannot forget to praise the hard work of our only judge who is resident in Nunavut. She is soon to be Madam Justice Beverly Brown.
Since Justice Brown came to live in Iqaluit, she has dedicated herself to educating our court officials, lawyers, justices of the peace and community justice committees. She has also taken the step of involving our community groups in her court. Justice Brown has broken down many barriers to Inuit understanding, by using, evaluating and speaking about our courts. The Nunavut court of justice is now just one part of our Nunavut approach to dealing with conflicts.
I will now speak about the justices of the peace. At present, we have 26 women and 56 men who are justices of the peace. There are 82 in total. These justices of the peace have been trained and categorized into three streams to indicate their level of experience and ability to deal with particular matters. The Nunavut Department of Justice is building on this by creating a better system of administrative support for our justices of the peace that will also deal with recruitment and ongoing education.
I shall now turn to the subject of community justice initiatives. Each community in Nunavut has a community justice committee and several larger communities have separate committees for adult diversion and youth. Strong links have been forged between the RCMP and these community justice committees to encourage communication and to maximize diversion.
Family group conference training is a new venture for community justice committees. The idea behind this is very familiar to the Inuit. Before any contact with the RCMP or courts, we resolve conflicts in a Qatimajun, which is a special meeting to deal with family and community problems.
The Nunavut Department of Justice intends to support community justice committees in our new territory and to encourage their aspirations. As ADM, I have travelled throughout Nunavut meeting with committee members. They are optimistic that with more resources and support they can intervene, even in more serious cases, to the benefit of everyone involved.
The community justice committees often provide a voice to individuals touched by a conflict. They allow us to hear the wisdom of elders and respected members of our community. For many of us, these committees brought us our first sense of ownership over justice as practised in our communities.
We believe that the Nunavut justice system and the Nunavut courts of justice will continue to be helped by even stronger community justice committees to bring us safer and more peaceful communities. Court hearings are also community events, and are most beneficial when our communities see and understand more and care about the justice system and the people involved.
The next issue I shall address is prevention. My department is working to support better crime prevention programs and aftercare in Nunavut.
On the subject of community corrections, we hope to change the current reliance on social workers for providing probation services. Social workers in Nunavut are governed by the health board and have many mandates to fulfil. Our goal is to have stand-alone probation services better able to meet the needs of offenders, our communities and the court.
My next topic is the Nunavut Corrections Planning Committee. As you may be aware, Nunavut presently has only one secure facility for offenders, the Baffin Correctional Centre. Many have to serve sentences far from home and from any hope of culturally relevant programming. The Nunavut Corrections Planning Committee includes representatives of CSC, territorial corrections, the RCMP, former inmates, and the three regions of Nunavut. They have many issues to address, particularly in deciding what kinds of facilities, staff, training, and inmate programs will best serve Nunavut.
In conclusion, I am anxious to see this legislation receive the Senate's assent. I believe our efforts have produced a court system that will work for Inuit. I believe this initiative has the potential to incorporate the best of the Inuit contemporary and traditional knowledge about court systems and dispute resolution. I believe our process in developing the court system was shaped by, and belongs to, all of the residents of Nunavut. I believe it can bring justice back to our communities and families.
I am also excited by the positive feedback and harmonious feeling that was created by our process, and I would like to see that continue as well. It has become a model for Inuit involvement and for broad consultation that has given new vitality to the idea of justice and to many other initiatives in Nunavut. Nunavut will continue to strive for a justice system that brings peace.
The Chairman: Thank you all. We will now proceed to questions.
Senator Beaudoin: Thank you for appearing before us. We have been talking about the one level court system at the superior level, the Alberta Court of Appeal, and possibly the Supreme Court if it is a very important case -- and some cases may be very important.
What about the bar? We have here two legal counsel. I understand that you are working for the Crown in right of Canada. You come under the authority of the federal department. It is a unique system that is proposed, and it cannot be otherwise, but what is the bar doing? Will the bar be located in the capital of the territory?
Mr. Jim Posynick, Legal Counsel, Department of Justice (Nunavut): If I may, I should like to explain my role with the Department of Justice, which is to assist the department in setting up the administrative component that would complement this legislation -- things such as court programs, court administration, and the justice of the peace program. In the course of that, I have worked closely with the Northwest Territories judiciary, Judge Browne in Iqaluit, and with both bars. I am a member of the Northwest Territories Bar. Actually, I am a private practitioner in Yellowknife.
Members of the bar in Nunavut and in the Northwest Territories have, of course, been aware of these changes for some time. The feedback that I have had as part of my own consultative process is very positive. That is probably because it is recognized that Nunavut is a special environment, both geographically and culturally.
Although questions have arisen, and will continue to arise from time to time -- constitutional questions about the composition of the court, and so on -- I think the bill addresses those questions. There are remedies in place for the Nunavut Court judge to hear such matters as summary conviction appeals and for a single judge of the Court of Appeal to hear appeals from those matters; so there are special provisions in place for that, at least for the interim. Until something perhaps changes with respect to the Court of Appeal in the future, the bar at this point seems fairly content. Having said that, as you may expect, we do not know what the net effect will be in any particular case. There may be some challenges along the way, but that is part of the legislative process as well.
Senator Beaudoin: I do not have a problem with the structure of the judicial system in Nunavut. It is quite logical, in my opinion, to have a one-level court, and of course there is the possibility of going to the Court of Appeal in Alberta.
I understand you have 82 justices of the peace. That is important under our system, because the capital, Iqaluit, is very remote and the distances could be a big problem, I imagine.
The first question that comes to my mind is whether they have a bar, other than the bar of the Yukon and Northwest Territories. The second question is whether they have legal aid, as we have in all provinces of Canada. We need that because it is always expensive to go before a court of justice, and not everyone is in a position to do so. How will they deal with that as a day-to-day problem? Say they want to enter a contract, any kind of contract, or they want to go to court to defend themselves on a charge or accusation. They will have to see a lawyer. Do the lawyers come from Ottawa, or from the department here in Ottawa, or do they come from the bar of the Yukon or Northwest Territories, or from Nunavut? What is the situation?
Mr. Posynick: The active membership in the Nunavut bar presently, I believe, is about 15. The members of the Northwest Territories bar will eventually be grandfathered.
However, your point about legal aid and accessibility is a good one, and it has been addressed. There are presently four legal aid clinics in Nunavut; one is in Pond Inlet, one is in Cambridge Bay, one is in Rankin Inlet, and the main office is in Iqaluit. There is much more legal aid work in Nunavut than private work, and there has been since the territory was created.
The short answer is that there has been a great effort to keep those clinics going. They used to be part of the legal services of the Northwest Territories, but an agreement is in process of being put together that will divide those services so that they will then be administered out of Iqaluit. There are legal aid services readily available to the population.
Senator Beaudoin: Is the bar now comprised of 15 lawyers?
Mr. Posynick: The bar is roughly 15 lawyers, but that will definitely expand as of April 1. Some will be grandfathered. We anticipate that there will be many applicants once the bar is set up.
Senator Beaudoin: The system they have will obviously be the common-law system.
Mr. Posynick: Yes.
Senator Beaudoin: The real estate system will be that of the common law. Will everything be registered in Iqaluit?
Mr. Posynick: Yes. Real estate in Nunavut is presently a matter of leasehold transactions, the Crown being the holder of the land.
Senator Beaudoin: The title is in the Crown, in the right of Canada?
Mr. Posynick: Correct. The legislation provides for the duplication of a registry. With respect to land titles, legal registers, and the registration of security documents, all of that infrastructure is being formed as we speak and has been the result of this ongoing consultative process.
The relevant legislation comes from the Northwest Territories. We have a mirror effect, and those services will be in place.
Senator Beaudoin: They will follow the pattern of the two other territories, to a certain extent.
Mr. Posynick: Yes. They will follow the Northwest Territories.
Senator Beaudoin: Except that in that territory, 80 per cent or 85 per cent of the population is aboriginal people. That is the big difference.
Mr. Posynick: Absolutely.
Senator Beaudoin: Of course, they have their own customs; they do not have their own law, but they have treaty rights.
Mr. Posynick: There is customary law, and the court is very sensitive to that. Part of the community justice program is to learn what they do not know about that. They want to ensure that the customary component is part of that one-level trial court process, in whatever way that can be achieved, whether by way of diversion to community programs, or taking it into account at sentencing.
Mr. Maclure: My friend and I do not appear before you today on behalf of the Crown in the right of Canada. We are not with the federal Department of Justice. I am counsel to the Nunavut Tunngavik, an organization that represents the interests of all Inuit in the Nunavut settlement area. Our responsibility, fundamentally, is toward the implementation of the Nunavut Land Claims Agreement.
As Ms Williams indicated earlier, Mr. Posynick is here today with her to assist with respect to any legal questions that might arise.
As we speak, a Nunavut law society is about to be created. It will be in place on April 1. As my friend mentioned, the membership within Nunavut itself may be small, but a large number of applicants have expressed interest in joining, one as far away as Memphis, Tennessee.
Senator Beaudoin: That is the American law. He will have to learn Canadian law.
Mr. Maclure: With respect to the location of the registry office, it will not be in Iqaluit; it will be in Kugluktuk. That is part of the government philosophy being advanced within Nunavut, and it is a decentralization idea.
Senator Beaudoin: The reason I asked the question about real estate is that it is fundamental under section 35 of the Constitution Act of 1982. The title to property is of the utmost importance, and treaty rights are of the utmost importance. Everything will be registered where?
Mr. Maclure: Kugluktuk.
Mr. Posynick: It was formerly Coppermine, at the headwaters of the Coppermine River.
Senator Beaudoin: Is it near Iqaluit?
Senator Fraser: That is the other end of the territory, 1,000 miles away.
Senator Bryden: I also wish to thank you for your presentations. They have been very informative. They gave me an opportunity to hear your language spoken, I must say, in a more flowing manner than I had heard it spoken by my colleague to my left, when he spoke in the Senate at the time the act was passed. It is a very beautiful language.
Madam Chair, if possible, could the text which was read be attached to the proceedings of this meeting?
Ms Williams, this is an historic occasion for you and your colleagues, and all of us are pleased to be part of it. I know a little about your area, having spent a considerable amount of time in the Northwest Territories in my speckled past, including a very long weekend in Senator Adams' motel in Rankin Inlet and a very nice time in Iqaluit, which was then Frobisher Bay.
I am interested in Nunavut Tunngavik Inc. I understand that it represents certain organizations. What is its structure? Does it have a board of directors?
Mr. Maclure: NTI's predecessor was the Tunngavik Federation of Nunavut. TFN was involved in the negotiation of the land claim. When the land claim was signed, NTI came to be. It is charged with the responsibility of ensuring that the land claims agreement is implemented.
NTI represents the Inuit of the Nunavut settlement area. Its executive is elected by them. We have a president, a first and second vice-president, and a vice-president of finance. Jose Kusagak is our president. There are three offices; one in Iqaluit, one in Rankin Inlet and one in Cambridge Bay. We have various departments within NTI, one being our implementation department.
There are three other agencies, which are regional Inuit organizations, located in the three regions, one per region. They have various responsibilities accorded to them under the agreement.
Senator Bryden: Are they sections of the overall corporation?
Mr. Maclure: They are responsible to NTI.
Senator Bryden: The executive is elected. Are they elected at large by the Inuit population?
Ms Evic-Twerdin: Yes. The four executive members are elected by the Inuit of Nunavut. The president of each regional Inuit association sits on the board. I believe that a member of Nunavut Trust sits on the board as well. That makes up the entire board of Nunavut Tunngavit.
Senator Joyal: What will be the role of this corporation on April 1, once you have gone through the election process and you have a government? I can understand that during the interim period you need a body to negotiate and put into place the new system of government. However, once the statute that establishes the territory comes into force on April 1, what will happen to the corporation?
Mr. Maclure: The corporation will continue. It has many functions under the land claims agreement. It has responsibilities to ensure that various articles of the agreement are implemented.
NTI is separate and apart from the public government. We have an executive elected by the Inuit of the Nunavut settlement area. Those elections will continue after April 1. There will be new executives in the years to come. Its responsibility will be to work in partnership with the Government of Nunavut and the federal government to ensure that the rights and obligations included in the terms of the land claim agreement are implemented.
Senator Joyal: In other words, you will become a contractor to the new government? I am trying to understand this in the context of provincial or federal governments, which normally have sole authority to represent the people and have the responsibility to monitor the rights that they will have under land claims settlements. I am trying to understand the relationship you will have with the government.
Mr. Maclure: There will be full cooperation, but NTI is a separate entity. It is not part of the government. We are there to ensure that the land claims agreement is properly implemented. To be Inuit you must hold a certain status, and that is provided for under the terms of the agreement. The government of Nunavut will be there for all who reside in Nunavut. NTI is there to ensure the land claims agreement is implemented on behalf of the Inuit, who are its beneficiaries.
Senator Joyal: If I correctly understand the thrust of the bill we are being asked to adopt, it is to ensure that the justice system better reflects the traditions, the perceptions and the needs of the Inuit people. My concern is that the Inuit receive fair treatment within the justice system. If I may put it this way, I would like to see the "Inuitization" of the legislation or the laws that the justice system has the responsibility to implement. In other words, the penal code, the Canadian Criminal Code and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms may have application in the new territory, but what about the other legislation?
It is your intention to develop a law that is a clear reflection of your tradition, your values as a society and your aspirations as a people who want to re-establish a presence in the justice system that you have not had for hundreds of years, but how far are you willing to go in your pursuit of that law?
Ms Williams (interpretation): It is hard to understand the criminal justice system and what it is trying to accomplish for Inuit people. However, we have here the opportunity to find out what the Inuit in Nunavut and all the people in Nunavut want. It was their idea to organize this meeting.
To us, the Nunavut Court of Justice is one little piece of a bigger picture. Earlier, I talked about community justice. Communities are trying to better reflect what their individual needs are, because the criminal courts and jails have not done everything, even though they have tried. They have done a good job, but people are still coming back from jails and doing the same things again.
It will take time. It has taken us 40 years to come this far. All the programs and policies have come from outside our community, but we now have people who believe they can do something better. What we are talking about today, with respect to the court, is only a small part of something much larger, and it will not do much by itself. However, we need to understand that the people got together to come up with this, and this is what they want. Perhaps Mr. Posynick can elaborate on that.
Mr. Posynick: First, it would, perhaps, be going too far to say that the legislation represents the "Inuitization" of the law. This certainly falls within the constitutional framework of the criminal law. Secondly, you have to realize that this process has developed in part through the implementation of the spirit of this legislation and in part from understanding what its net effect will be.
Soon-to-be Madam Justice Brown, the senior judge of the Nunavut Court of Justice, has undertaken the teaching of legal principles to a community of justices of the peace on Baffin Island. That has resulted, amongst other things, in a shifting of perception on that island. It is more of a community-based justice system, although it operates on the same principles that all justices of the peace operate on. It has resulted in some approaches to sentencing and to diversion that have, for the past several years, worked very well.
So there is already a model there. In fact, this legislation makes the justices of the peace come under the supervision of that senior judge. To that extent, it is not as if this is a beginning point, because it has been happening for some time. The full intention is to maintain that overall supervision of the Canadian justice system through to the Supreme Court of Canada.
I hope that comment helps.
Senator Adams (interpretation): Although I am not a member of this Legal and Constitutional Committee, I am present today because this issue is important to me personally.
Having said that, I want to ask you a two-part question. First, with respect to the 200 people incarcerated in the Northwest Territories, if Bill C-57 receives Royal Assent, what will happen to those inmates? Will the Baffin Correctional Centre become empty? What will be the RCMP's responsibility? Will they work closely with this kind of system, following the bylaws of the hamlets and the communities?
Ms Williams (interpretation): First of all, on the issue of the jails, I would say that they will remain the same. The only difference will be that they will have better home support, but, so long as social conditions in the Northwest Territories stay the way they are, there will not be much of a change. The only change that will result is from within the communities. With the social conditions changing, they will have more support for ongoing programs and, as well as including Inuit and combining the different systems, there will be a better delivery of programs in the communities.
At the present time, there are 64 people in the Baffin Correctional Centre, and the same in the Yellowknife Correctional Centre, and 80 people have been sent to Borden, Alberta, having been convicted and sentenced in the Supreme Court.
Concerning your question regarding the RCMP, the Solicitor General has contracted with Nunavut that on August 31 the RCMP will be the police of choice for Nunavut. On Wednesday they will have a meeting to study a better way of delivering the policing system, including a better outreach aimed at including the youth in becoming members of the RCMP. I can only see that the support for the by-laws on the hamlet level will be strengthened, as well as supported, including funding.
Mr. Maclure: There exists a body known as the Nunavut Social Development Council. That council is charged with the responsibility of dealing with the social issues, and obviously the matter of criminal law and its impact upon Inuit would be a social issue. The NSDC, just last year, had a retreat for justice officials near Rankin Inlet. One of the points of having that retreat was to impart some Inuit ideas about justice and healing. From all accounts, those few days away on the land were very well received.
Under the mandate of the NSDC, I would anticipate seeing them continuing to work with the justice system, trying to better the situation.
Senator Adams (interpretation): For those who are incarcerated, what sort of charges are they mostly facing?
Ms Williams (interpretation): The majority of charges have been for child abuse, sexual assault, child assault, and violent assault. Also, the greater number of charges have been against repeat offenders; there has been much recidivism, with people going in and out of jail, coming out not reformed.
Senator Moore: Senator Grafstein, who had to leave for another meeting passed on a question which he would have liked to ask. His question deals with the legal aid clinics. Perhaps Ms Williams or Mr. Posynick could answer this, please. How will the legal aid system be funded?
Mr. Posynick: In fairness, I have not seen the concluded agreement. Traditionally, in the North, legal aid services have been funded in part by federal money and in part by Northwest Territories' government funds, which is tantamount to the same thing. I do not know and I am not able to inform you, sir. Perhaps Ms Williams is aware of the source of the funding for Nunavut.
The Chairman: Perhaps you could find out and get the information to the committee.
Ms Williams (interpretation): That is what I would suggest. We could get back to you on just exactly how that will be funded.
Senator Moore: The second part of Senator Grafstein's question depends on the answer that you can find for us, and that is whether or not the funding is adequate, in your estimation, to provide reasonable access to the courts and to ensure a justice system that is one of fairness for all.
The Chairman: I should like to follow that up with our witnesses, that they will get this answer back to us as quickly as possible, because we are on a fairly strict time line with this bill.
Mr. Posynick: Yes, Madam Chair.
Senator Moore: Last week, I asked Minister Anne McLellan a question about the justices of the peace; she said it would be better to ask that question of the representatives of the new commissioner; therefore, I will ask you people.
You indicated earlier, Ms Williams, that there would be 82 justices of the peace. It seems to me, from the evidence we heard last week, that the justices of the peace are a very important part of this whole system, given the geographical area and the way the communities are spread out. Are you satisfied that the number is adequate, that there will be access for the people in these far-ranging communities, that the justices of the peace will be trained adequately and that there will be funding to do that training?
Ms Williams (interpretation): We have 82 justices of the peace right now in 27 communities. They are receiving ongoing training by Judge Browne and other lawyers. We will be hiring a person to focus on that, to train and to recruit justices of the peace.
When we had our meeting in November, there were many justices of the peace in the room, because we knew that they would be impacted by what we are doing here today. They took part and were obviously more informed than many of us. We all, including them, recognize that they are an important part of this puzzle that we are trying to put together. We wish to ensure that they will have the funding to continue their training and to what they need to do.
Senator Moore: Who provides that funding? Is it the new territorial government?
Ms Williams (interpretation): The funding is done through the territorial government. It has been and will be with the new government. The administrator, who will be looking after them or working with them, will be answering directly to Judge Browne.
Senator Moore: Further to the questions of Senators Bryden and Joyal, how often are the corporation's elections to be held? You mentioned that there are four executive positions elected by the Inuit. How often are those elections?
Mr. Maclure: I think it is a four-year term. However, I may be mistaken on that. It is at least two years, and possibly four.
Ms Evic-Twerdin: It is usually two or three years. There was recently a change made to that.
Senator Moore: The land claim involves a payment by the Government of Canada to the Inuit people of approximately $1.2 billion. Does part of your corporation's mandate involve administering those funds, which are being paid over 14 years? Who receives the money? That is a significant amount of money to manage and requires good advice to manage it.
What happens to the money and who gets it? I do not know if the new corporation or new territorial government receives it to run its affairs. Does it go to the people? How is that determined?
Mr. Maclure: There is an organization known as the Nunavut Trust that is located in Ottawa. Within that trust are individuals who are very adept at financial management. They are charged with the responsibility of managing the moneys that flow from the federal government under the terms of the agreement.
That in part answers your question, but it also picks up on a point raised by Senator Joyal. The land claims agreement is constitutionally protected. If you have an opportunity to look at the agreement, you will see that section 35 provides that protection.
The moneys to which you refer, senator, are part of the agreement. Those moneys, as I indicated, go to the trust. From there, they flow to NTI, and through its processes the moneys are spent on behalf of the beneficiaries in Nunavut, either by NTI or through designated Inuit organizations under the umbrella of NTI. NTI is responsible for designating them as such.
Senator Moore: Do the moneys go to the government of the new territory?
Mr. Maclure:: No. Under the terms of the negotiated land claims agreement, the moneys flow to the Inuit, not the public government.
Senator Moore: Of the 25,000-member population of the new territory, or 22,000 or whatever it is, how many are Inuit? Would it be 85 per cent? In other words, are those funds solely for the benefit of the 17,000 or 18,000 Inuit?
Mr. Maclure: To the extent that the community is better, it probably goes to the benefit of all. However, the money is designated for the beneficiaries. Inuit status is determined under Article 32 of the land claims agreement.
Senator Moore: What sort of things do you envisage these funds being spent on for the benefit of the community?
Mr. Maclure: I have already referred to the Nunavut Social Development Council. That would be one example.
Senator Moore: Just pursuing that example, what would they do with the funds? Do they come to you with a request and you approve the application?
Mr. Maclure: Their operational budget would be provided by NTI. There would be a budget submitted, and money would be allotted for its yearly operations.
In terms of other activities, under the agreement there are responsibilities that go to land and resource management, water management, assessing developmental impact, governmental contracts and technology.
Senator Moore: Many of these things that you mention are governmental in nature south of the 60th parallel in terms of activities and responsibilities. It sounds as if these things are being shared between the government of the new territory and NTI.
Senator Adams: Five years ago we had a settled land claim. The NTI was negotiating the land claim. I think the land claim settlement was $580 million. Those moneys were put in trust. The NTI has been operating since then on the interest from that money. They have not spent that money yet.
Of course, the government of the Northwest Territories has been operating for the territory that is now Nunavut; they used to spend over $1 billion a year governing the Northwest Territories in the east and the west. Now that Nunavut has taken over some part of the territorial government, the territory goes south and now Nunavut will be governing that. That is the system. Not much has changed.
Incidentally, I pay taxes here in the south, too.
Senator Moore: I am trying to get a feeling for how long NTI would be needed. It sounds as if it will be there for a long time.
Mr. Maclure: I would submit that so long as there is a land claims agreement in effect and protected under the Constitution, there will be an NTI.
Senator Andreychuk: What we are basically talking about in the NTI is the settlement agreement with the aboriginal peoples on their lands. It is similar to the other settlements across Canada. It does not really impact on this proposed legislation, nor does it impact on how the territory will be governed. Am I correct?
Mr. Maclure: To an extent, we would agree with you.
Senator Andreychuk: There are implications coming out of the agreement.
The Chairman: It seems to me there are vast implications stemming from the agreement, if money is power and power flows to where the money is and the money is in the hands of the NTI. Historically, this has been the case and will continue to be the case. The government of the new territory is probably in a unique position in Canada.
Mr. Maclure: It might be of assistance, were I to read an excerpt from the preamble to the agreement.
AND WHEREAS the Parties agree on the desirability of negotiating a land claims agreement through which Inuit shall receive defined rights and benefits in exchange for surrender of any claims, rights, title and interests based on their assertion of aboriginal title;
AND WHEREAS the Parties have negotiated this land claims Agreement based on and reflecting the following objectives:
to provide for certainty and clarity of rights to ownership and use of lands and resources, and of rights for Inuit to participate in decision-making concerning the use, management and conservation of land, water and resources, including the offshore;
to provide Inuit with wildlife harvesting rights and rights to participate in decision-making concerning wildlife harvesting;
to provide Inuit with financial compensation and means of participating in economic opportunities;
to encourage self-reliance and the cultural and social well-being of Inuit;
That is part of the preamble to the agreement.
The Chairman: That is something that is set in law and set in the Constitution. I quite agree with you. This validates what I was just saying. The power and money is with the NTI rather than with the government of the entire population of the area, which brings me to my concerns about it. What about the substantive rights of the non-Inuit people of the area? For instance, you were talking about the 200 inmates; are those Inuit people who have been found guilty of something, or is that the total criminal population of the area, both Inuit and non-Inuit who have been found guilty of something?
Ms Williams: That is the total population.
The Chairman: They are people who have committed crimes on Nunavut territory and are now incarcerated in various places, including the Baffin facility.
Ms Williams: Yes.
Senator Joyal: I take it for granted that the information Senator Adams gave us is correct and that the trust fund was entrusted with $580 million. Am I right in saying the yearly proceeds from that would be between $17 million and $25 million a year? I made a rough calculation of what the interest could be.
Mr. Maclure: I am not an accountant. I could not give you an answer to that question. We could find out what the income is, if you wish, but I do not have it at hand.
Senator Joyal: I am trying to get an idea of the availability of funds for the overall operation of the new government. My concern is with the responsibility of Ms Williams as Deputy Minister of Justice. I understand that the Department of Justice, for which you are responsible, together with the forthcoming Minister of Justice --
Ms Williams: As of next week, yes.
Senator Joyal: You will have the responsibility of drafting a proposed budget, and that proposed budget will need to take into account the money available coming out of the trust fund, if I understand the procedure.
The Chairman: No. The people who administer the trust fund, and who are represented here, are a non-governmental organization. It is completely separate from the government of the territory. The government of the territory will set up its own budget according to its income. Whether money flows from the group on our left to the group on our right is a decision that will be made.
Senator Joyal: Who will tax whom?
Mr. Maclure: Please keep the ideas of NTI and the public government separate and apart. They are separate entities. In terms of the trust, Article 31 of the agreement speaks to the establishment and the mandate of the Nunavut Trust. It is not a lengthy article. I can provide the honourable senators with a copy, if you wish, or, if you wish me to read it, I could do that.
The Chairman: We do have that here. We can get it.
Senator Joyal: My point is the following: I am, as are all my colleagues around the table, sympathetic to the plight of people who have been wrestling with a justice system in order to make it reflective of the needs of the Inuit people. No doubt there is a need for a very efficient rehabilitation program in the incarceration system, something more than existed in previous years. It is a priority you will want to address, much as you are addressing the priority of training justices of the peace and other officers of the justice system. That will be your responsibility as well.
I am concerned about the money to ensure that those things happen. If we want to see a change within a reasonable period of time -- and you will be responsible for taking reasonable steps to make those changes happen, then you will need a significant amount of money.
It may look like a very simple question, but I am trying to understand whether what we are doing here is realistic; is it possible that we are expecting things to change, without there actually being the means to make the changes that we all hope will happen?
Senator Andreychuk: I would like to add to that. I think Senator Joyal is right. When the minister was before us, the point was made that the system would be more efficient, and both Senator Pearson and I expressed the hope that they would not reduce the moneys and look at that as being efficient, because we felt that the system needed even more money in order to be a proper justice system.
I think your point is well taken. Where will the money come from to make it work?
Senator Joyal: Perhaps we are not in a position to have a definitive answer today, but I feel it is a fundamental concern.
The Chairman: Perhaps we can give Ms Williams a chance to try to answer that question and see where it takes us.
Ms Williams: We could probably provide you with the full budget of our department and the breakdown. I do not have it with me. We do not have a political leadership right now, so we are still at the preparation stage. I talked about the need for change. I think we have the same question. We need to have money to make change happen.
Usually, when you talk about a community-level kind of programming, you look at volunteer programs; but sometimes they are not adequate to address the issues we are facing.
Our budget will probably be different once we have a government and a Minister of Finance and people like that. At the moment, there are only deputy ministers and an interim commissioner doing some work to prepare for the Nunavut government.
Mr. Posynick: If I may add to that, as Ms Williams has indicated, that is the case. There is incremental funding available until April 1 for the operations of this putative government. Then, as of April 1, there is funding available for the year 1999-2000, and we have a budget for that. Certainly, that can be provided if you are interested in a particular category within that budget.
The Chairman: Senator Joyal, are you interested in the budget itself, or is it the fact that there may or may not be adequate funds?
Senator Joyal: I am interested in both. I would certainly be interested to get that from Ms Williams, because she seems to have prepared a proposed budget, and then we can get some idea of the reality behind the structure and objectives of what we might call the "Inuitization" of the system. On the other hand, we certainly would like to know how that budget fits into the overall financial responsibility of the government, and whether it is realistic to expect that those things could happen.
Ms Williams: I do not think there is ever enough money with any government. We are always lacking money. The NTI designated organization that they refer to as the Nunavut Social Development Council has ways to talk to the territorial Nunavut government or to Parliament to let those people know what our social state is in Nunavut, and to let them know that "This is what we must have." They could also help us with that, because they have been working very closely with us.
That does not really address your question, but if you have lots of money, we would be happy to take it with us.
The Chairman: The matter of funding is a bit beyond the purview of this committee, which is to consider the bill that is before us and to determine whether or not the justice system will work, and in that respect I should like to have from you some reassurance that you believe that the justice system will be able to work because there will be adequate funds.
Perhaps, Mr. Maclure, you have something to add to that.
Mr. Maclure: Yes, I do. Ms Williams referred to the function of the NSDC. Under the terms of its mandate, it is responsible for providing an annual report to Parliament. In many ways, that would be a state-of-the-nation assessment that would look at the needs and circumstances of the territory and at how the federal government might be of assistance and should be informed.
The chairman referred to the bill that is before this committee. This is a bill that will provide for the necessary changes to give effect to a single level trial court. I know from my conversations with Mr. Bebbington that the salaries and the travel expenses of the three superior court level judges are picked up by the federal government. That is not a territorial responsibility.
Senator Joyal: But certainly for the justices of the peace the administration of justice is a territorial responsibility.
Mr. Maclure: I agree. In many ways, that is a political decision that is the responsibility of the legislature once it sits in April.
Mr. Posynick: To add to what my friend has said, as the person who is administering those court services programs and trying to set them up for implementation as of April 1, I can tell you that there is a significant budget for justices of the peace for training. As Ms Williams said, we are in the process of hiring a professional person who has significant experience in training justices of the peace. There is also a significant budget for travel. As Mr. Maclure mentioned, although the federal judge portion gets paid, there is a larger portion involved in the transport of other persons and things. The budget covers those things as far as we have been able to estimate.
At this point in time, we do not anticipate any shortfall. There are other programs involved in that budget. For example, there is a coroner's program, and there is the equivalent of a human rights officer, or fair practices officer, a landlord and tenant dispute officer, and a labour standards function. All that is covered under these programs.
From the point of view of putting the budget together, for the year 1999-2000, it meets the projected needs.
Senator Moore: This may be a bit outside our consideration of the bill, but bearing in mind that the NTI has a substantial role in the community, is it the social council that is set up under the agreement or is it one of the other community councils? If it were necessary, for example, to assist the implementation of the justice system, could your department access funds from NTI for the good of the Inuit people?
The Chairman: Perhaps we should ask the NTI that.
Mr. Maclure: The simple answer would be "No," because we are not the government.
Senator Bryden: I think we are sort of off base here, because the number of people participating in the land claims settlement that resulted in the NTI would include the majority of the people there. We would not be asking the same question, if you were asking about the province of New Brunswick and the land claims settlement for the Mi'kmaq. The government of New Brunswick will have to budget and fund its funds for all its people out of either its taxes or its equalization payments, which it receives from Ontario and all those wealthy people.
When I was involved with the Northwest Territories government, my understanding was that they had a budget, but the source of their funds was the Government of Canada. That is the way it is now. Similarly, for some time to come, the principal source of funds for the government of Nunavut will be the Government of Canada. That is, again, equalization from the nice people of Ontario, as it should be.
Over time, there will be, perhaps, more contributions from local businesses into the tax flow, but the fact that $580 million has been put into a trust fund, which is part of a much larger payment for rights or identification of rights to hunt, or to participate in the government of this huge territory, is totally irrelevant in relation to whether or not we can find the funds to run the system that we are talking about. It would be sort of like the problem they have with the Nisga'a treaty in B.C. There is never a question about how much of the funds they receive from their land settlement will be paid to administer the justice system in British Columbia. There is none. That is a separate issue.
I think we may be misleading ourselves by the fact that such a large part of the population is affected by both and, therefore, we think there is some flow between them. There is not, as I understand it.
The Chairman: I think the quiet silence that followed your lecture demonstrates that you are completely correct.
Senator Adams: I have one more question. About 15 per cent of the people are not registered in Nunavut. What would happen if one of those people broke the laws of the community? For example, if someone did not like the law he could say, "I am not a citizen of Nunavut." How would that affect Bill C-57? That person could decide to hire his own lawyer, but if he is not from Nunavut, how will that work out?
Mr. Posynick: Because of the way Bill C-57 is structured and the way it amends the criminal code it applies to all persons, irrespective of cultural background. The benefit of any justice programs that are available to persons who might be in breach of the law in Nunavut will be a benefit extended to all. That is the short answer.
Senator Beaudoin: We heard a few moments ago that the Charter of Rights applies equally in Nunavut. That is true, but do not forget that the aboriginal population comes under the Criminal Code of Canada. There is no doubt about that. As far as rights are concerned, the Charter of Rights includes a section that states that aboriginal people have some treaty rights, and other rights, under section 35. To that extent, they do not have the same regime that we have in the provinces for everyone, because we have such a thing in this country as collective rights, and aboriginal rights are collective rights. Do not forget that. So when we say that the Charter applies to them, we must qualify that to a certain extent, because some rights may be different. I just wanted to say that for the purposes of the record.
For criminal law, there is no problem, but when we are talking about rights such as treaty rights or collective rights for the aboriginal people -- and, the Supreme Court uses the word "aboriginal nations" -- it may be quite different.
Mr. Maclure: If I may just pick up on Senator Beaudoin's comment, the word "Tunngavik" is akin to "trust" as in: "Trust -- having a responsibility for." That reflects the idea of collectivity, and the concept that the Inuit are together under this land claims agreement and that NTI has that trust responsibility toward them all.
Ms Evic-Twerdin: If I may add to that, NTI, as an organization, also is accountable to the Inuit beneficiaries of Nunavut. They have an annual assembly to whom they report. At that assembly, the budget proposal is reviewed and approved.
I wish to add a bit about some of the activities that are being undertaken and funded through the Nunavut trust agreement. Some of the beneficiaries, such as the elders, are provided with support from that funding. We have an elders benefit program, an enrolment program, and a hunter support program.
I would also like to elaborate on the role of the Nunavut Social Development Council. Although they are funded from NTI for operational purposes, as a non-government organization and as an aboriginal social organization, they are also eligible for outside funding sources such as funding from the federal government for programs.
Senator Joyal: Is it possible to contemplate that, in the budget that you will propose eventually for the assembly of Inuit people, there could be programs aimed at rehabilitation, at prevention of crimes, or at better education with respect to the law and the responsibilities of citizens in this society, where everyone must abide by a certain code of conduct?
Ms Evic-Twerdin: Anyone here can elaborate on that, but NTI and the DIO -- that is, the designated Inuit organizations established under the claim -- are responsible for ensuring that Inuit interests are promoted and supported. That also translates into NTI enforcing all the governments, to ensure that Inuit interests are respected. NTI will have to work with the Nunavut government to ensure that they undertake their mandate to benefit everyone, including Inuit.
I also wish to give you an example to paint the picture more clearly. In the Arctic, in the Nunavut land claims agreement, for example, Article 23 enforces that the Nunavut government or the governments will employ 85 per cent of Inuit in the Nunavut settlement area. That 85 per cent stems from the population total of Inuit in Nunavut. Those are the kinds of activities and rights of the beneficiaries of Nunavut that NTI supports.
The Chairman: Thank you very much.
Mr. Maclure: With respect to initiatives of the NSDC that might touch upon the concern that you raised, several initiatives are being funded just now that are going towards the reconnection of traditions, as communicated by the elders to the young, and building community that way and building a sense of the social fabric that way, through language initiatives, through getting-back-to-the-land initiatives, and through the communication of the traditions and the history that the elders are best situated to do.
The Chairman: At this point, I should like to thank all of you for having come so far to help us in our deliberations.
This is an historic piece of legislation. We are setting up a brand new legal system in Canada. Our deliberations are historic, and because of that I should like to come back to Senator Bryden's comment that your language is extremely beautiful to listen to. I am sure it is equally beautiful in written form and, if we may and are able to do so, we would be pleased to have a copy of your initial remarks in your own language so that we could append that to our proceedings for this day.
(The Inuktitut text of the statements by Ms Evic-Twerdin and Ms Williams are appended as Appendix A and B respectively.)
Ms Williams: Ms Qitsualik-Tinsley is prepared to type up what we read from our notes. We will provide that to you as soon as we can. Thank you for asking for it.
The Chairman: Thank you for coming here and joining us today.
The committee adjourned.