Proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on
Legal and Constitutional Affairs

Issue 11 -- Minutes of Proceedings

OTTAWA, Thursday, May 16, 1996
(13)

The Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs, met this day in Room 356-S, Centre Block at 10:30 a.m., the Chair, the Honourable Senator Sharon Carstairs, presiding.

Members of the Committee present: The Honourable Senators Beaudoin, Bryden, Carstairs, Doyle, Gigantès, Kinsella, Lewis, Losier-Cool, Milne and Pearson. (10).

Other senator in attendance: The Honourable Senator Shirley Maheu.

In attendance: Kristen Douglas, Research Officer, Research Branch of the Library of Parliament.

Also in attendance: The official reporters of the Senate.

WITNESSES:

For Bill C-275:

From the House of Commons:

Robert Walsh, General Legislative Counsel, House of Commons;

Stephen Knowles, Procedural Clerk, Private Members' Business, House of Commons;

Richard Prégent, Deputy Principal Clerk, Private Members' Business, House of Commons.

For Bill C-13:

From the Department of the Solicitor General:

Helen Banulescu, Chief, Law Enforcement Group;

Cpl. Jeff Warren, RCMP;

Warren Black, Senior General Counsel.

The Chair made an opening statement.

Pursuant to the Order of Reference adopted by the Senate on Tuesday, May 14, 1996, the Committee commenced its consideration of Bill C-275, An Act establishing the Canadian Association of Former Parliamentarians.

The Chair agreed to move a motion in the Senate asking that a message be sent to the House of Commons expressing the Senate's concern with the treatment of Senate public bills by the House of Commons.

At 10:38 a.m., pursuant to the Order of Reference adopted by the Senate on Tuesday, April 30, 1996, the Committee continued its consideration of Bill C-13, An Act to provide for the establishment and operation of a program to enable certain persons to receive protection in relation to certain inquiries, investigations or prosecutions (See Issue No. 10, Thursday, May 9, 1996, for full text of the Order of Reference.)

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Doyle -- THAT Clause 9, sub-clause (1) be amended by striking out lines 25 and 26 on page 4 and substituting the following:

"protection provided to a protectee if the evidence shows that there has been"

After debate, it was moved by the Honourable Senator Bryden -- THAT the motion by Senator Doyle be amended to read: THAT Clause 9, sub-clause (1) be amended by striking out lines 25 and 26 on page 4 and substituting the following:

"protection provided to a protectee if the Commissioner has evidence that there has been"

After debate, the question being put on the motion in amendment, it was agreed.

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Lewis -- THAT Bill C-13 be reported to the Senate with one amendment.

The question being put on the motion, it was agreed.

At 11:25 a.m., the committee continued its consideration of Bill C-275.

Mr. Rob Walsh made a statement and answered questions.

Mr. Stephen Knowles answered a question.

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Gigantès -- THAT the committee report Bill C-275 to the Senate with a recommendation that the Senate not proceed with Bill C-275.

After debate, it was moved by the Honourable Senator Lewis -- THAT the question on the motion moved by Senator Gigantès not now be put, but that the committee defer its decision until further evidence is heard.

After debate, the question being put on the motion by Senator Lewis, it was negatived, on division.

After debate, the question being put on Senator Gigantès' original motion, it was negatived, on division.

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Milne -- THAT Bill C-275 be amended, in the English version, in clause 2, on page 1, by striking out lines 13 to 15 and substituting the following:

"who was, but is not at present, a member of the Senate or House of Commons of Canada;"

The question being put on the motion, it was agreed.

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Milne -- THAT Bill C-275 be amended, in the English version, in clause 5, on page 2, by striking out lines 10 to 12 and substituting the following:

"(d) to foster good relations between members of the Senate and House of Commons of Canada and former parliamentarians; and"

The question being put on the motion, it was agreed.

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Beaudoin -- THAT Bill C-275 be amended, in the French version, in clause 2, on page 1, by striking out lines 17 and 18 and substituting the following:

"teur ou député au Parlement du Canada, mais qui n'est plus ni séna-"

The question being put on the motion, it was agreed.

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Beaudoin -- THAT Bill C-275 be amended, in the French version, in clause 5, on page 2, by striking out lines 12 and 13 and substituting the following:

"ses entre les sénateurs et députés actuels et les ex-parlementaires:"

The question being put on the motion, it was agreed.

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Doyle -- THAT Bill C-275 be amended in clause 7, on page 3, by striking out lines 10 to 14 and renumbering paragraphs (i) to (k) and any cross-references thereto accordingly.

The question being put on the motion, it was agreed.

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Lewis -- THAT Bill C-275 be reported to the Senate with five amendments.

The question being put on the motion, it was agreed, on division.

At 12:24 p.m., the committee adjourned to the call of the Chair.

ATTEST:

Heather Lank

Clerk of the Committee