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Proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on
Defence and Security

Issue 1 - Evidence, May 10, 2001

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OTTAWA, Thursday May 10, 2001

The Standing Senate Committee on National Defence and Security met this day at 12:35 p.m. for an organization meeting.

[Translation]

Ms. Barbara Reynolds, Clerk: Honourable senators, we have a quorum. As Clerk of the Committee, it is my duty to oversee the election of a chairman.

[English]

I am ready to receive a motion to that effect. Are there nominations for chairman?

Senator Forrestall: I nominate Senator Kenny.

Ms Reynolds: Are there any other nominations?

Is it agreed that Senator Kenny be chair of the committee?

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

Ms Reynolds: Carried.

I invite Senator Kenny to take the chair.

Senator Colin Kenny (Chairman) in the Chair.

The Chairman: Thank you for the vote of confidence, colleagues.

We have before us an agenda that calls for some motions.

I need a motion with respect to the deputy chair.

Senator Meighen: I move that Senator Forrestall be deputy chair.

The Chairman: All in favour?

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

The Chairman: Carried. Moving to item number 3, the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedures, I put forward the name of Senator Cordy.

Senator Atkins: I so move.

The Chairman: All in favour?

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

The Chairman: Carried. The motion to print proceedings would read that we start at 200 copies, with the power to adjust from time to time.

Is it agreed, honourable senators?

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

The Chairman: Carried. Item number 5, authorization to hold meetings to print evidence when a quorum is not present. The rule is two, one from each party; is that correct?

Ms Reynolds: Yes.

Senator Meighen: For my information, would that apply, for instance, in the event of a task force or, say, a meeting between sessions?

The Chairman: That is correct. It is also for a situation where if a witness is present as long as each party is represented two people can take the testimony, which will then become part of the record for the committee.

Is it agreed, honourable senators?

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

The Chairman: Carried. Regarding research staff, might I suggest that we need research staff but that we discuss names over the next week or two. We should canvass the Library of Parliament, which has the best price, but see whether other names come forward for consideration as well.

Senator Forrestall: I wonder if we could ask the Library of Parliament to submit two or three names, or some other source, and then make our selection from that.

I notice that the motion reads "That the Committee ask the Library of Parliament to assign research officers" - plural. Is that plural, or does it mean officers to the committee from time to time. That is leaving it both plural and singular, depending how, from time to time, we might want to interpret it.

We may have an issue before us that has a broad external affairs component to it, and if we have a pure militarist acting as our researcher he or she may be inadequate for some other areas. It is to give the chair the flexibility. With that minor amendment to the motion, you will have achieved that.

The Chairman: I would like very much to have a variety of names to look at. As for sources, if you look at our mandate, I think it includes more than the military. I think it would include elements of the Solicitor General's department, under national security. We might find that there are people in that department.

During the committee hearings that Senator Rompkey chaired in 1995 with Senator De Bané, we had some pretty good four-stripers who travelled and met with the committee on a regular basis. We could not make up our minds whether they were there to help us or to spy for the Chief of Defence Staff; either way, however, the committee felt they were good resource people.

Senator Rompkey: I think it is a good idea to have someone of colonel rank or higher. If you can get a general, get him, but you probably will not. Overall, our experience was a good one. It was more positive than negative. We got more out of it than we lost. It would be a good idea to approach the Chief of Defence Staff to assign an appropriate officer to the committee.

The Chairman: It occurs to me also that there are a variety of folks in academia who have expressed interest. They have approached us individually from time to time on issues. In any event, we can leave the question open. If honourable senators have names or ideas of where they would like to look, I would welcome hearing from you, either directly or through the clerk, whatever is most convenient.

Shall we revisit this question again, once we have some proposals for the committee to consider?

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

Senator Forrestall: You can refer the question to the steering committee and ask that they report back at a later date.

The Chairman: Motion No. 7, what is involved here?

Ms Reynolds: This is the authority to commit funds.

The Chairman: Of which we do not have any.

Ms Reynolds: We do not have any. This is a standard motion that goes through each committee. Basically, once you have the budget, this allows you to actually go out and spend the money and then certify that it was spent for the purposes intended. It is basically signing off invoices.

Senator Rompkey: I so move.

The Chairman: All in favour?

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

The Chairman: Carried. Motion No. 8 is for travel. It empowers the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure to designate as required one or more members of the committee to travel.

Senator Meighen: I so move.

The Chairman: All in favour.

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

The Chairman: Carried. Number 9 is travelling and living expenses of witnesses. My understanding is that this does not come out of our budget.

Senator Rompkey: There is a special witnesses fund.

Ms Reynolds: It is handled by the Committees Directorate on a directorate-wide basis.

Senator Hubley: I so move.

The Chairman: All in favour?

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

The Chairman: Carried. Motion No. 10, the question of electronic coverage of public meetings.

Senator Cordy: I so move.

The Chairman: All in favour?

Hon. Senators: Agreed.

The Chairman: Carried.

If I could, I would ask the committee if they would be prepared to go in camera at this point.

The committee continued in camera.

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