Proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on
Legal and Constitutional Affairs

Issue 3 - Minutes of Proceedings

[English]

The Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs met at 3:55 p.m., this day, in room 257, East Block, the Honourable Senator Milne, Chair, presiding.

Members of the committee present: The Honourable Senators Andreychuk, Beaudoin, Cools, Fraser, Grafstein, Joyal, P.C., Milne, Moore, Nolin and Pearson (10).

In attendance: From the Library of Parliament: Nancy Holmes and Jay Sinha.

Also in attendance: The official reporters of the Senate.

WITNESSES:

Panel of Academics:

Mr. Michael Behiels, Ph.D., Department of History,University of Ottawa;

Mr. Max Nemni, Ph.D., Professor, Department of History, Laval University.

Academic:

Jean-François Gaudreault-DesBiens, Ph.D., Professor, Faculty of Law, McGill University.

Pursuant to the Order of Reference adopted by the Senate on February 7, 2001, the committee proceeded to study Bill S-4, A First Act to harmonize federal law with the civil law of the Province of Quebec and to amend certain Acts in order to ensure that each language version takes into account the common law and the civil law (See Issue No. 1, Wednesday, February 21, 2001 for full text of the Order of Reference.)

The Honourable Senator Milne introduced the witnesses and the Honourable Senator Beaudoin, Deputy Chair, took the Chair.

Professor Max Nemni and Professor Michael Behiels made opening statements and answered questions.

At 5:15 p.m., the Honourable Senator Milne resumed the Chair.

The Honourable Senator Fraser objected to certain statements made by Professors Nemni and Behiels and asked that they retract them.

The Honourable Senator Cools raised a Point of Order, stating that the witnesses may not be asked to retract their statements.

Professors Nemni and Behiels continued to answer questions.

Professor Gaudreault-DesBiens made an opening statement and answered questions.

At 6:35 p.m., the committee adjourned to the call of the Chair.

ATTEST:

OTTAWA, Thursday, March 22, 2001
(5)

[English]

The Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs met at 10:50 a.m., this day, in room 257, East Block, the Honourable Senator Milne, Chair, presiding.

Members of the committee present: Andreychuk, Beaudoin, Cools, Fraser, Joyal, P.C., Milne, Moore and Pearson (8).

In attendance: From the Library of Parliament: Nancy Holmes and Jay Sinha.

Also in attendance: The official reporters of the Senate.

WITNESSES:

From the Department of Justice of Canada:

Alain Bisson, Senior General Counsel, Civil Code Section;

Yves DeMontigny, Special Advisor to the Senior Assistant Deputy Minister, Public Law;

Alain Vauclair, General Counsel, Civil Code Section;

France Allard, General Counsel Comparative Law, Director, Legislation Services Branch;

Louise Maguire-Wellington, Legal Counsel, Civil Code Sec tion;

Guy Faggiolo, General Counsel, Civil Code Section.

Pursuant to the Order of Reference adopted by the Senate on February 7, 2001, the committee proceeded to study Bill S-4, A First Act to harmonize federal law with the civil law of the Province of Quebec and to amend certain Acts in order to ensure that each language version takes into account the common law and the civil law (See Issue No. 1, Wednesday, February 21, 2001 for full text of the Order of Reference).

It was moved by the Honourable Senator Cools, - That the letter and appendices sent by Mr. Alain Bisson to the committee be appended to the Minutes of this meeting.

The question being put on the motion, it was - Resolved in the affirmative.

Alain Bisson, Yves DeMontigny, Alain Vauclair, France Allard, Louise Maguire-Wellington and Guy Faggiolo answered questions

At 1:15 p.m., the committee adjourned to the call of the Chair.

ATTEST:

OTTAWA, Wednesday, March 28, 2001
(6)

[English]

The Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs met at 3:40 p.m., this day, in room 257, East Block, the Honourable Senator Milne, Chair, presiding.

Members of the committee present: The Honourable Senators Beaudoin, Buchanan, P.C., Cools, Fitzpatrick, Fraser, Grafstein, Gustafson, Joyal, P.C., Milne, Moore and Pearson (11).

In attendance: From the Library of Parliament: Nancy Holmes and Jay Sinha.

Also in attendance: The official reporters of the Senate.

Pursuant to the Order of Reference adopted by the Senate on February 7, 2001, the committee proceeded to study Bill S-4, A First Act to harmonize federal law with the civil law of the Province of Quebec and to amend certain Acts in order to ensure that each language version takes into account the common law and the civil law (See Issue No. 1, Wednesday, February 21, 2001 for full text of the Order of Reference).

It was agreed, - That the committee proceed to clause-by- clause consideration of Bill S-4.

It was agreed, - That the title stand postponed.

It was agreed, - That the preamble stand postponed.

It was agreed, - That clause 1 stand postponed.

It was agreed, - That clauses 2 and 3 carry.

It was agreed, - That clauses 4 to 7 carry, on the following division:

YEAS: Milne, Beaudoin, Buchanan, Cools, Fraser, Moore, Pearson - 7

NAYS: Joyal - 1

ABSTENTIONS: Grafstein, Gustafson - 2.

It was agreed, - That clauses 8 to 178 carry.

It was agreed, - That clause 1 carry.

The Honourable Senator Grafstein moved, - That Bill S-4, in the preamble, be amended:

(a) on page 1, by deleting the preamble; and

(b) in the English version of the enacting clause, on page 2, by replacing line 1 with the following:

"Her Majesty, by and."

The question being put on the motion in amendment of the Honourable Senator Grafstein, it was negatived on the following division:

YEAS: Cools, Grafstein, Joyal, Moore - 4

NAYS: Milne, Beaudoin, Buchanan, Fraser, Pearson - 5

ABSTENTIONS: Gustafson - 1.

The Honourable Senator Joyal moved, - That Bill S-4, in the preamble, be amended:

(a) by adding before line 1 the following:

"WHEREAS Canada is exceptionally enriched by the coexistence of two legal traditions, the common law and the civil law;

WHEREAS the common law and the civil law must each grow and develop in English and French to find their fullest expression in a Canadian context;"

(b) by replacing lines 4 to 7 with the following:

WHEREAS the Civil Code of Québec is the principal expression of the civil law tradition in Canada;" and

(c) by addition after line 22, the following:

WHEREAS the objective of the Government of Canada is to facilitate the full development in federal legislation of the common law and civil law traditions in their English and French versions;"

The question being put on the motion in amendment of the Honourable Senator Joyal, it was negatived on the following division:

YEAS: Cools, Grafstein, Joyal, Moore - 4

NAYS: Milne, Beaudoin, Buchanan, Fraser, Gustafson, Pearson - 6.

The Honourable Senator Moore moved, - That Bill S-4, in the preamble, be amended on page 1, lines 15 and 16:

(a) by deleting the words "a window on the world"; and

(b) by inserting in the place and stead thereof the words "enhanced opportunities world-wide."

The question being put on the motion in amendment of the Honourable Senator Moore, it was negatived on the following division:

YEAS: Grafstein, Joyal, Moore, Pearson - 4

NAYS: Milne, Beaudoin, Buchanan, Fitzpatrick, Fraser, Gustafson - 6.

It was agreed, - That the preamble carry, on the following division:

YEAS: Milne, Beaudoin, Buchanan, Fitzpatrick, Fraser, Gustafson, Pearson - 7

NAYS: Grafstein, Joyal, Moore - 3.

It was agreed, - That the Title carry.

It was agreed, - on division, - That this Bill be adopted without amendment.

The Honourable Senator Pearson moved, - That an observa tion be included citing the proposal in the Minister's letter dated March 20 to the Chair, to add the following paragraph to the Summary of the Bill:

"Generally, in provisions that describe a legal concept by using a common law term and a civil law term, the common law term appears first in the English version and the civil law term appears first in the French version. Examples of this are "real property and immovables" in the English version and "immeuble et biens réels" in the French version."

The question being put on the motion, it was agreed.

It was agreed, - That the Chair report this Bill with the observation at the next sitting of the Senate.

At 5:15 p.m., the committee adjourned to the call of the Chair.

ATTEST:

Jill Anne Joseph

Clerk of the Committee