Proceedings of the Subcommittee on Veterans Affairs
Issue 7 - Evidence - October 27, 2010
OTTAWA, Wednesday, October 27, 2010
The Subcommittee on Veterans Affairs of the Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence met this day at 12:04 p.m. to study on the services and benefits provided to members of the Canadian Forces; to veterans; to members and former members of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police and their families.
Senator Fabian Manning (Deputy Chair) in the chair.
[English]
The Deputy Chair: Good afternoon. I would like to call to order this meeting of the Subcommittee on Veterans Affairs of the Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence.
I would like to welcome our guests here today. From the Royal Canadian Legion, we have Mr. Brad White, Dominion Secretary; and Mr. Pierre Allard, Service Bureau Director.
We have several senators here. I will ask everyone to introduce themselves. I am Fabian Manning, from Newfoundland and Labrador.
Senator Neufeld: Richard Neufeld, from British Columbia.
Senator Wallin: Pamela Wallin, from Saskatchewan, Chair of the Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence.
[Translation]
Senator Pépin: I am Senator Lucie Pépin from the Shawinigan region.
[English]
Senator Rompkey: Bill Rompkey, from Newfoundland and Labrador.
The Deputy Chair: As a note, Senator Rompkey served in the Royal Canadian Navy.
Senator Wallin: We were discussing the issue in your absence.
The Deputy Chair: I welcome you here today. I have the opportunity to chair today in the absence of the regular chair of this committee, Senator Dallaire, who is out and about.
My understanding is that our guests have some opening remarks, after which we will have the opportunity for senators to ask questions and engage in dialogue concerning the New Veterans Charter and anything else we have today.
Brad White, Dominion Secretary, Royal Canadian Legion: Before we begin, I would like to say something on behalf of the Royal Canadian Legion. On Monday, we presented the Governor General with the first poppy, which is symbolic of the opening our National Poppy Campaign. The campaign starts this Friday and runs through to November 11. On behalf of our dominion president, I would like to present you all with a poppy, as well.
The Deputy Chair: The poppies should not be worn until Friday, when the campaign starts.
Mr. White: The actual campaign does start on Friday.
The Deputy Chair: Be careful about putting it in your pocket.
Mr. White: It is a great pleasure to appear before you today on behalf of The Royal Canadian Legion and our dominion president, Patricia Varga. Ms. Varga will be joining us soon for the celebrations of Remembrance Day and as we work toward Remembrance Week, as well.
On behalf of the legion, I would like to thank the committee. We offer our support for your continuing advocacy on behalf of all veterans of all ages and their families. We in The Royal Canadian Legion care, and we know you do, as well.
[Translation]
You have a copy of our presentation for today.
[English]
We have given you copies of our presentation, in both French and English and a copy of our primer on the New Veterans Charter, which we will discuss further in the presentation today. We have been asked to talk about what we are doing for resolutions, so I have also provided you with a copy of our resolution book from our convention in Winnipeg this past June.
We are fully aware that your committee has been briefed on numerous occasions on the New Veterans Charter. We also know that you know that the New Veterans Charter is more than just a lump-sum disability award.
Unfortunately, broader aspects of the New Veterans Charter are not necessarily well known within the public, even amongst members of the Canadian Forces and within our veterans communities. We feel this could have been overcome with better and more effective communications. However, it was good to see the information entitled "Our Veterans Matter" that was published this past weekend in the paper from Veterans Affairs Canada, which is helping to bring some of that message and education forward today.
We would like to share with you how the legion plays its part in communicating the information about the New Veterans Charter to our members. As I mentioned, we have provided you with a copy of our primer on that charter. This primer was recently published in the last edition of Legion Magazine. It is distributed to all of our 350,000 members, and it also reaches a broader Canadian public community because the magazine is now available on the newsstands across the country. Our market share or readership is close to one million people.
We have also published an updated version of our Service Officer Handbook, which you have before you as well. This handbook is for the benefit of our branch service officers who act as referral agents, mostly for our command service officers. This handbook contains contact information not only for the legion but also for Veterans Affairs Canada, the Bureau of Pensions Advocates, the Veterans Review and Appeal Board, the Last Post Fund and some Canadian Forces agencies that deal with the injured. It also contains background information on the legislation, services and benefits, application appeal processes and benevolent assistance.
You have been briefed on representational services provided by Veterans Affairs Canada, VAC, and the Canadian Forces, CF, at the newly established Integrated Personnel Support Centres, IPSCs. Our command service officers have established a regular presence at most IPSCs to offer a representation option for applicants at all levels of the disability process, from the first application through to helping with appeals at the Veterans Review and Appeal Board.
Last year, our service bureau network across the country submitted more than 2,000 first applications; 60 per cent of those were to what we would call the modern veteran. Over the past two years, we have noticed this trend of helping and assisting newer veterans is increasing markedly.
As we stated previously, the New Veterans Charter, VAC, is indeed a package of services and benefits that promotes early intervention and focuses on ability not disability. Gaps and deficiencies have been identified in the New Veterans Charter by the New Veterans Charter Advisory Group, NVCAG, in their report, through the parliamentary standing committee report and in other fora, including legion resolutions, which you have before you as well.
The recommendations coming from these various committees have produced a blueprint for government action. We are pleased with the recent announcements of proposed legislation to fix some of those gaps. We are hopeful that more action is still forthcoming.
Additional veterans issues include eligibility criteria for long-term care and health care benefits; funeral and burial benefits, which we just recently spoke on in an op-ed editorial to the newspapers; accessibility to family health care; the currently structured VAC disability award; the negative impact on the military career of female members, as they often fulfill the role of the family caregiver; issues for females of improper or ill-fitting equipment; and, of course, concerns with harassment.
Notwithstanding recent initiatives, the issue of communication and outreach remains problematic, which is why, in addition to our current efforts, we will be drafting a proposal to set up an outreach program. We have already discussed this initially with Veterans Affairs Canada. This outreach program would be modelled on our successful Long Term Care Surveyor Program, which we conduct right now.
The objectives would be not only to educate but to reach out to injured members of the Canadian Forces and to the reservists when they return to their homes. The IPSC is doing very good work on smoothing out the transition challenges. However, the reality is that some individuals do not seem to do well through the transition stage and the re- establishment challenges they sometimes reach two or three years down the road. This is where an outreach program is needed. The legion, through our network, through our community and through our branches across the country, is very well positioned to assist in this outreach program to reach our veterans and reservists.
In summary, the Royal Canadian Legion believes that more communication and outreach is required to fully communicate the breadth of services and programs provided under the New Veterans Charter. While we are doing our part now, we are exploring with Veterans Affairs Canada and other agencies establishing further options to improve that outreach in the future. I would now like to turn it over to my colleague, Pierre Allard, who will talk about legion priorities.
[Translation]
Pierre Allard, Service Bureau Director, Royal Canadian Legion: The Legion advocacy process is based on resolutions adopted by our members at our biennial Dominion Convention. The blue book, which has been distributed to you, summarizes these resolutions.
At our last convention in Winnipeg, our members adopted a number of resolutions which have been prioritized by our Veterans, Service and Seniors Committee. The Legion's high-priority resolutions focus on specific themes, keeping in mind the Legion's vision that "we care for all veterans of all ages and their families."
These themes are the following: modern veterans, the New Veterans Charter; traditional veterans; mental health issues, including homeless veterans; reaching out to the Royal Canadian Mounted Police; and our seniors.
Within this thematic approach, and keeping in mind that for the Legion, the term "veteran" includes still serving members, the following resolutions are considered high priority by the legion. Some of these may actually fit under more than one theme: agent orange application; offset of the Veterans Affairs Canada Disability Pension by Service Income Security Insurance Plan Long Term Disability; ensuring that disabled veterans receive a fair equitable income consistent with a normal military career; death benefit under the New Veterans Charter; Veterans Independence Program for the Royal Canadian Mounted Police; ensuring quality long-term care for veterans; support for survivors and families of wounded or deceased; beds and care facilities; Sainte-Anne-de-Bellevue Hospital; determination of Canadian Forces Superannuation Act Survivor Pensions; Veterans Affairs Canada funeral and burial benefits; improved mental health care for Canadian Forces members, veterans and families; Homeless Veterans Program; and Canada Seniors Independence Program modeled on the Veterans Independence Program.
We are also working with the Canadian Forces and outside agencies that provide support to Canadian Forces members and their families, including financial support and outreach through the Canadian Forces Morale and Welfare Program while contributing to discussions to identify gaps in this program. This will guide our future advocacy and intervention. The views expressed above are also shared by the Canadian Naval Air Group, the North Atlantic Treaty Organization Veterans' Association, the National Aboriginal Veterans Association, the Air Force Association of Canada, and the Royal Canadian Naval Association.
[English]
The Deputy Chair: Thank you very much for your presentations. I will ask Senator Wallin to begin our questions.
Senator Wallin: I am glad to hear that there is acceptance and that you have embraced some of the changes that have been announced to the New Veterans Charter. We are all awaiting, as promised, some changes to the lump-sum payment approach to this, and I think the minister has made it clear that that it is coming.
Have you been consulted on that? Are you involved in the process? Is there anything you can say to us that will help frame whatever it is that they will announce?
Mr. White: It was a typical consultation. The announcements made recently are welcomed by the Royal Canadian Legion. We see them as having a positive effect to start moving forward with the New Veterans Charter. We felt for a long time that the New Veterans Charter was languishing a little and not being paid attention to. These changes that are now coming forward are good, and we hope they go through legislation very quickly so that we can actually have that assistance reach the people who need it.
On consultation, we do a lot of consultation with Veterans Affairs Canada and with the other veterans groups. Mr. Allard is a regular member of the New Veterans Charter Advisory Group; and through our representation — principally on that group — we continue to push forward on what you see in our resolutions about changes that are required in the New Veterans Charter.
We, too, hope that lump-sum payment issues, the disability award, will be addressed quickly and effectively to everyone's satisfaction when it comes forward. We hope that comes soon because we see a progression now of changes coming forward, and this is one of the logical next changes that is needed within the legislation.
Senator Wallin: We hope it comes forward quickly and receives speedy passage in both houses of Parliament. Do you have a view of the issue of the lump-sum payment?
Some options are to replace it or to make it an option. There are many alternative approaches out there. What do you favour?
Mr. White: We think that the issue of the disability award is very misunderstood not only by veterans, members of the Canadian Forces, but also by the general public. There is a lot of information out there, and we want people to understand that the lump-sum payment is for pain and suffering of an incident. We believe that the current amount of $276,000 plus change is insufficient and inconsistent with what is happening in some of those types of workers' compensation issues that are happening in Canadian courts today.
We understand veterans need control over their own finances, and they should have control over their finances to determine how they would like to receive that payment.
The disability award is not a substitution for the pension under the old Pension Act. We understand that, but it would be nice to be able to give the individual receiving that disability award the option of how the award is received and over how many years it is received. However, I do not think we should confuse the disability award with the pension payment.
Senator Wallin: I do think that is misunderstood. Other money flows in a parallel system there.
Mr. Allard: Structured options are also probably an important mix that could be offered to recipients. Sometimes some people cannot deal with receiving a very large lump sum, and other options should be on the table, either combinations of payments on a yearly basis and a smaller lump sum or simply extended payments. Again, at the end of the day, individuals have the right to make the choices that they want.
Senator Wallin: Thank you. I appreciate that.
[Translation]
Senator Pépin: You talked about a different impact when it comes to female military members. Could you explain what the difference is?
[English]
Mr. White: The inclusion of women in the Canadian Forces, and particularly in combat roles, in the history of the Canadian Forces is a relatively new phenomenon. Naturally, when you introduce something new, you have to break many barriers to push on forward and, in many cases, gain acceptance in how issues are being perceived.
The Canadian Forces is making great strides. I left 12 years ago, and in my unit at that time, we had no women in an armoured unit in Germany; nowadays, women are in combat roles as much as men. The system needs to adapt and change and will adapt and change over time as people become more accepting, familiar and understanding of some of the different natures of needs for men and needs for women because they are different.
[Translation]
Senator Pépin: I have heard that funds will be allocated to those who were critically injured and to those living with permanent impairments. Could you explain what the difference between the two is?
Mr. Allard: I assume you are talking about the additional $1,000 that will be allotted.
[English]
Veterans Affairs Canada is making a difference between the requirements for a Permanent Impairment Allowance, which may or may not meet the same criteria of someone who is critically injured. The reason they are making this difference is because to be eligible for a Permanent Impairment Allowance under the current regulation you have to have 100 per cent assessment. It could be that someone could be critically injured and may not have attained that 100 per cent assessment right now but could later on if they are reassessed.
In that context, that is where the differentiation is made. Permanent Impairment Allowance requires 100 per cent assessment. The critically injured allotment of $1,000 for life, taxable, does not require that 100 per cent assessment. That is where I think that VAC is showing some flexibility.
There is no flexibility currently in the context that there are dual clients, some of whom are already receiving an Exceptional Incapacity Allowance that may be only based on an assessment of 50 per cent — sorry, I am saying that wrong. People could be currently assessed under the Pension Act at 50 per cent and could be assessed under the New Veterans Charter at 50 per cent, and they are not eligible for either the Permanent Impairment Allowance or the Exceptional Incapacity Allowance. That is something VAC is trying to correct. An unintended consequence of the New Veterans Charter is that there are now people who are assessed at 100 per cent but under two different pieces of legislation.
[Translation]
Senator Pépin: Do you think that the $1,000 amount will be sufficient?
Mr. Allard: I think that, ideally, the $1,000 amount should have been non-taxable. Regardless, it is still a step in the right direction.
Senator Pépin: Did I understand correctly that people are no longer eligible to receive this amount after they turn 65?
[English]
Mr. Allard: The Earnings Loss Benefit stops at age 65, not the critically injured $1,000 provided for life. In addition, after age 65, the Supplementary Retirement Benefit is also available.
We are also indicating in our advocacy goals that the post-age-65 deficiencies should be corrected. We do not think that the Supplementary Retirement Benefit is sufficient; there should be something more generous that would help people post- age 65. Providing $1,000 to the critically injured for life is a good first step.
[Translation]
Senator Pépin: The reality is that people usually need more help after the age of 65.
[English]
Mr. Allard: This deficiency was identified right from the beginning when the New Veterans Charter was introduced.
The Deputy Chair: On your comments on consultations on the New Veterans Charter, are you satisfied with the consultations with the legion and your input on the issues in relation to the New Veterans Charter and having those addressed? You mentioned in your remarks about some of the recent announcements. From the point of view of the Royal Canadian Legion, reaching out to you for advice and suggestions, how have you found that process?
Mr. White: The process has been very good. From the very beginning, we were involved in the Veterans Affairs Canada-Canadian Forces Advisory Council and the New Veterans Charter Advisory Group when this package was being brought together, and I think it was helpful. It was not just the legion. Other veterans' organizations and specialists were at the table as well. In the formative stages of the New Veterans Charter, I think it was good all the way through.
Our issue is we have identified those areas that needed to be addressed in the New Veterans Charter. Those areas are now being reflected in the advisory group's recommendations as well as the recommendations of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Veterans Affairs, ACVA. We have not seen much movement on those. It appears that while we were bringing points forward on changes that were needed, they were just being ignored. Now of course, we see some movement coming into the New Veterans Charter to address some of the deficiencies in the charter, and we are glad this has finally happened.
We agreed on the charter initially when it came in because it was a living document. We believed after it was passed in legislation, that it was not living; it was set in concrete. We believe that a bit of life has been put back into the charter now, so we are happy that things are starting to move.
The Deputy Chair: Resolution No. 9, from your convention, concerns, I believe, the family-centred culture of VAC. We have had discussions here about the fact that services are available to assist the veteran and that the family is involved in the process. In some cases, benefits are extended to family members who need them.
Could you elaborate on what you would like to see in that area? You have put forward an important resolution, and we, as a committee, need to have a response.
Mr. White: I grew up in a military family. I was part of the D, F and Es — dependents, furniture and effects. We moved every two or three years. The military has its own culture. It is a difficult process for the military family to be accepted in the places where they reside for only two or three years. Many of the relationships you would expect to develop while living in a city for a long time are not developed when you live in a place for only two years.
The concept of moving forward into developing programs for military families and recognizing that military families are more than just D, F and Es is very welcome. When members are deployed, the families back home look after the home fires. In the old days, when the regiments deployed, we always left a rear party back to look after the families, which was a very effective way to do it.
Today, there is a lot of independence in families with a whole new generation of people who see things a little differently. We need to be able to offer programs and services to the families, in particular to the kids who are going through traumatic events these days. Sometimes they do not receive the kinds of service and assistance that they need. To offer those types of programs, or even consider them, and to ensure that they are in place for the families is really essential because they are part of the whole soldier. The term "soldier" applies to more than just the individual; it includes his or her whole family. If you have a happy individual and a happy family, you probably have someone who can carry on with his or her focus and mission. It is important that families are considered and that services for families are provided.
The Deputy Chair: I found another of your resolutions interesting — on palliative care and improvements. Are you aware of any concern with palliative care for veterans? This is important.
Mr. Allard: Palliative care across the country is an ad hoc response; it is not standardized. It is offered in some facilities but not in all facilities. In the context of our traditional veterans who reside in long-term care facilities, palliative care might not be available at end of life, depending on their province of residence. It is in that context that we are approaching this issue. From our perspective, even though VAC basically has turned over their major facilities to provincial authorities, they still have a responsibility to maintain a standard of care across the country that is the same. It is in that context that we drafted that resolution.
It is a common issue related to what Mr. White was saying about care to families. Unfortunately, health care and mental health care are under some provincial mandate across the country, while providing health care to Canadian Forces members is the responsibility of the Canadian Forces; but it does not embrace the families or the children. We now have Canadian Forces members, less so, but possibly veterans who are approaching mental health care authorities under VAC autonomy through their operational stress injury clinics. As long as they self-identify as requiring mental health care, there is no problem; possibly they can bring in the family or the children under that umbrella. However, if they do not self-identify as requiring that care, then the family is left on the side. That is another challenge.
The Deputy Chair: That is an interesting point.
Senator Wallin: I have two different questions, but I want to follow up on the issue raised today by the deputy chair on the role and involvement of the families. We know that huge privacy concerns are emerging at this time about access to information on veterans.
As well, we have heard from wives and husbands that we, in protecting the privacy of the soldier, exclude the family. They want to be brought to the table if their spouses are not asking for psychological care when they think he or she needs it. Do you have any advice on wrestling with that issue, which we have heard about on the bases that we have visited?
Mr. Allard: My only advice is that the case managers have to show more flexibility in approaching how they treat mental health issues as they relate to the veteran or to the Canadian Forces member. They have to assume at the outset that when there is a mental health issue, it affects the family and the children. That must be a basic assumption taken into account by any intervention, whether or not it is asked.
Senator Wallin: That is the issue; and we also have the Charter of Rights staring us in the face about whether you can do it.
May I veer off into another area for just a moment? This comes from the daughter of a legionnaire — I have joined a branch of the Royal Canadian Legion at home, so I guess I should declare that conflict. My father is the first to admit that only four or five of them are sitting at the legion meetings, although a few younger ones have come in to join under the family rule or the original vets. My father has a weird sense of humour: He always says that it is hard for what is left of the branch to even do a funeral properly.
What is your vision for the future of the legion? We all agree that new veterans, in particular Afghanistan veterans, have found their legion, in a sense, online, where they communicate with each other. They are not signing up at the legions. Is that something that you will not make a huge priority and rather you will try to fix areas such as veterans charters; or is recruiting or bringing people into the fold a big issue for you?
Mr. White: The formation of the legion began back in 1925 and 1926. The first mandate of the Great War Veterans' Association, which was the largest organization then, was to look after veterans until they needed looking after. The second mandate was nation building.
Individuals who have served the country through World War I, World War II and onwards, in particular the two world wars, came back to Canada. They went home, took advantage of the programs offered and built their communities. When you read the obituaries these days, which I tend to do occasionally, you will read about the veterans and what they have accomplished, not only in their service to the country but also in their service to their community. Are we having difficulty these days? Everyone has difficulties these days. The nature of the community spirit in individuals is no longer there. Community mindedness in individuals does not exist. People are surviving. Dual-income families are out there working all the time. They do not have much time while raising their children and working to go out and participate in many of the community activities that we would like to see people participating in. We try to attract these kinds of people when they retire. We also try to attract the members of the Canadian Forces right now. We are reaching out to the Canadian Forces through our programs and support to the Canadian Forces by appearing before committees to talk about issues important to them on the New Veterans Charter; and by demonstrating that we are out there, mindful of what is happening and actively involved.
We are coming into the season in which everyone recognizes the legion, the Poppy Campaign and the annual remembrance, but people tend to forget the year-round cycle of what happens in a legion branch and how much they put back into veterans as well as their communities. The annual input back into communities across the nation through volunteerism and actual donations is valued at over $300 million.
The legion is recognized for what it does for veterans and its community. They are very quiet about it and proud of how they do it. It is not in the newspapers all the time, but if you ask them what they do, they will shyly tell you how much they are involved in the community and how they look after not only veterans but programs that support youth and their activities.
Senator Wallin: In a sense, you can wait until this new generation of veterans goes through the front end of their lives with young kids, dual incomes and relocations, and still try to reach out to them at a later point.
Mr. White: We are trying to reach out to them now. When I first joined the national headquarters of the legion, our defence committee toured all the military bases across Canada and explained what the legion does, the benefits we provide and how our services help people.
Today, people use BlackBerrys and electronics, so the legion has to evolve. I do not use the word "change" because change scares people, so I use the word "evolve." We are starting the process of evolution now. We are looking at how we do our business and how we will project ourselves into the future. That is all part of the nature of service, which is what we call it.
Mr. Allard: We want to inculcate that we care. As Mr. White said, we care for our community and for all veterans of all ages and their families. We are confident that we have bottomed out our membership decline and that it will increase in the future. That is what we are working toward, and I am sure that we will be successful.
The Deputy Chair: We wish you all the best in your endeavours with that. The legion plays an important role in many communities.
Senator Rompkey: I want to follow up on part of Senator Wallin's question about the new electronic world. Senator Wallin mentioned that Afghanistan veterans are keeping in touch in their own way. How is the legion adapting? We have just seen an interesting mayoralty election in Calgary, and we could cite other instances where whole new processes are taking place. You mentioned that people have BlackBerrys. Could you expand on how you see the legion adapting to social networking?
Mr. White: Bricks and mortar is a problem; infrastructure has always been a problem. Some of the branches are in big buildings that the legion has had for many years, and now they are having difficulty maintaining them. We have talked about the concept of a virtual legion branch. We understand the power of social media, so through both our defence committee and the veterans service and seniors committee we are looking at the concept of instituting a virtual branch where individuals who are so inclined and want to be in contact with their friends, particularly friends who have been on the same types of missions that they have been on, will have the opportunity to do that.
When you leave the military, the sense of service is still strongly engrained in you. We are trying to communicate to people that the sense of service that they developed in the military and the skills and professional attributes that they have come out of the military with can be put to use very well in serving their communities. It is all about being part of the community. We are trying to get into that and reach out to them now. We will develop a virtual branch to help do that.
Senator Rompkey: That would be particularly useful to people who are disabled, particularly those who are totally disabled. There is a chance of being cut off if you cannot get around, and I think that bears on the mental health issue as well.
Mr. Allard: It is not well known, but the Legion has a portfolio of Legion housing across the country to serve the needs of veterans and seniors as they age. We have been successful with that. We are also moving into the care of homeless veterans. We have a couple of projects ongoing on that. One is in Victoria, British Columbia, with Cockrell House, which assists homeless veterans to transition from being on the street to getting an education, a job or a place to live. Cockrell House is a place for them to live where they receive all the support they need.
In Ontario, we are developing another project called Leave the Streets Behind. The Royal Canadian Legion Ontario Command is sponsoring this with Veterans Affairs Canada, and there are strong indications that it will be a successful program.
Through all these programs and activities, we are trying to show that we care for all veterans of all ages and their families.
Mr. White: We run a successful program called the Long Term Care Surveyor Program in conjunction with VAC. We have trained people across the country who visit veterans and long-term care facilities to conduct surveys of the individuals on care, food, et cetera. The reports are sent to VAC so that there is constant monitoring of the care of veterans.
We are trying to develop into more of an outreach program for modern-day veterans in particular who may be disabled. I do not want to call them shut-ins because the majority are quite mobile and want to be out in the community. We are considering transitioning our Long Term Care Surveyor Program into visiting injured people in their communities to ensure that they are being looked after and that their mental health is okay after their transition. If we can transition this outreach program into something such as that as well, we can also reach people in the militia. There is 25 per cent deployment of militia reserve soldiers now. Those people may be out of touch when they return to their communities, and they may be developing issues that need to be looked after. It is important to ensure that they are looked after, that they know the assistance is there when they need it and want to access it.
The Deputy Chair: Concern was raised about the Veterans Review and Appeal Board with respect to Royal Canadian Mounted Police, RCMP, officers. One of your resolutions deals with addressing the concerns of the RCMP versus those of veterans. That is new to me.
I would like some feedback from you, as I have been involved in that for quite some time.
Mr. White: RCMP members are eligible to be members of the Royal Canadian Legion, but they fall under a different superannuation act. They fall under the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Superannuation Act, which is not covered under the New Veterans Charter. They are deploying into critical combative areas and are experiencing all types of issues. I will ask Mr. Allard to address the specifics.
Mr. Allard: I believe it would be nice to have an RCMP veteran on the Veterans Review and Appeal Board to have that interchange. A spouse of an RCMP member is serving on the board, but it would be good to have a member.
As we have been discussing with the Veterans Review and Appeal Board, VRAB, for almost year about, they have determined their own adjudicative guidelines. Those adjudicative guidelines have introduced a new term, which is the "balance of probabilities." We do not see the "balance of probabilities" as a term that appears anywhere, either in the Pension Act or the New Veterans Charter, or the Veterans Review and Appeal Board Act for that matter. What appears in that legislation is the benefit of the doubt. We are worried that, by introducing this term "balance of probabilities," it is making the adjudicative process a little too strict. We have expressed that to VRAB, and we would like them to amend their adjudicative guidelines.
Part of the rationale relates to some Federal Court decisions that they are hanging their hat on to accomplish this. However, other Federal Court decisions actually take another view, so they should be more circumspect in that matter.
Senator Rompkey: I want to ask about the Veterans Review and Appeal Board. I am glad you brought it up. I sat in on another meeting where that came up, and I asked some questions then. I thought it had disappeared, but it has not; it is still there.
Tell me how it is appointed, who sits on it, what its make-up is and how much business it receives now compared to what it used to received.
Mr. Allard: It is still very engaged as far as the business that they handle is concerned. This is off the top of my head: I think they did 5,000 reviews and appeals last year. Of those, of note, the legion did 500, so we do 10 per cent of the representation, whether it is with VRAB or VAC at first adjudication.
The makeup and the membership are under specific guidelines that are published on the VRAB site, where basically candidates have to meet certain parameters. They have to do and pass an exam. Then there is an interview process. Those who pass the interview process are then put on a list, and these people are picked from the list by the minister to be appointed to VRAB.
The process is relatively more structured than it was in the past; namely, there is elimination, where people have to establish their credibility through a written exam and then an interview.
Senator Rompkey: Is it by application?
Mr. Allard: You apply for the job.
Senator Rompkey: Can anyone apply?
Mr. Allard: Any Canadian can apply, yes.
Senator Rompkey: Any Canadian can apply to get on their list. However, who determines what the mix is on the board?
Mr. Allard: It becomes an issue of whoever is on the list.
Senator Rompkey: How many members are on the board?
Mr. Allard: I believe their makeup is about 26 members. I think they are allowed up to 29 permanent members. They can also hire additional members if the workload is too heavy. Right now they have 26.
Senator Rompkey: Of the 26 members, how many are veterans?
Mr. Allard: I am not too sure about that. I would say that perhaps 10 per cent to 20 per cent of them are veterans.
Senator Pépin: How many women are on the board?
Mr. Allard: Again, I cannot answer for VRAB on that, but there are some women on the board.
The Deputy Chair: Some recent appointments have been women; I know that.
Mr. White: I believe the underlying gist of your question is whether we think more veterans should be on the board, and, yes, we do; RCMP members as well.
Senator Rompkey: That was on my mind but also how effective it is and whether it is working as well as it should, apart from the membership issue.
Mr. Allard: From the context of what is in the newspapers and what happens in real life in the department, I look at the favourability rates on a regular basis. The favourability rates at the first level within Veterans Affairs Canada are running at anywhere from 60 per cent to 65 per cent. That is at the first call on benefits. There is another kick at the can within VAC, which is the departmental review. People who have not received a favourable decision can have a departmental review. Of those who have a departmental review, possibly another 50 per cent will have a favourable ruling.
Of the 20,000 applicants who have come to VAC to receive a favourable decision, approximately 5,000 of those migrate to VRAB. The favourability rate at the tribunal, at the first level of review, is approximately 50 per cent. At appeal, it is approximately 25 per cent. At reconsideration, which is an exceptional level, it is probably 10 per cent.
With all these favourability rates in sequence, one could logically conclude that if the evidence is there and if there is a disability and it is a recognized disability, the system is relatively generous. Unfortunately, some people fall between the cracks and maybe do not receive as timely a ruling as they should. Sometimes, from our perspective, it is because the department and the board focus too much on turnaround times. People should look at quality work in submitting applications, and I can vouch for command service officers in the legion. That is what we aim for; we aim for quality work when we do representation. We do not look at the turnaround times that much.
The Deputy Chair: In your earlier remarks, you touched on some of the changes coming forward, or issues being addressed might be a better way of putting it, with respect to the New Veterans Charter. Some of those changes will need regulatory changes. Some will need to be dealt with in the House of Commons and in the Senate.
From your perspective, do you have any advice to members in both the house and the Senate on the urgency of addressing those improvements or changes? Your opinions on those changes are important when it comes to the floor of the house or the Senate with respect to the effect that they will have on veterans and their families. Do you have any advice on that process?
Mr. White: When the New Veterans Charter was pushed forward in 2005, it was moved through quickly with all-party agreement. It did not take that long to get it done. I would hope that when we start to consider the recommendations and the changes that have been put forward to date, that those recommendations and changes will receive the same favourable consideration.
Naturally, a debate on some of the issues will probably have to take place, and we accept that. However, definitely we would like to see those issues put forward for implementation this fall as soon as we can do it. There are veterans who need assistance every day. Money matters to them. Money matters to their quality of life. It also assists in their mental health stability. If they do not have to worry about money, then they can worry about the other pressing issues.
We hope these changes will be considered quickly, move forward and be accepted, and put into practice.
The Deputy Chair: I appreciate your message. Are there any other questions?
[Translation]
Senator Pépin: We know that some veterans need home care. Among other things, it was proposed that those veterans be compensated. Compensation to the tune of $100 a month was suggested as a way of defraying their expenses. For what kind of expenses could a deduction be claimed and for how long? Also, would the money paid out be taxable?
[English]
Mr. White: We would hope there would be a revolving door, that every time there are expenses are put forward in that $100 range, it is not just a one-time allocation if more expenses have to be covered.
[Translation]
Senator Pépin: I believe that an amount of $100 a day has been suggested.
[English]
Mr. White: I would hope so.
[Translation]
Senator Pépin: Which expenses should be eligible for a deduction?
Mr. Allard: Transportation and meal preparation expenses should certainly be eligible.
Respite care is also needed. Those providing home care must also consider their own mental and physical health and must be able to have some time for themselves when they need it. During the respite period, the caregivers need to be replaced.
[English]
The Deputy Chair: Are there any other questions?
Senator Wallin: Because we are multi-tasking today, we are looking at the issue of reservists at the main committee. I am sure I know the answer to this, but am I correct that there is no difference in status for reservists at the legion?
Mr. White: There is none whatsoever.
Mr. Allard: We have also made our benevolent funds available to still-serving members.
Senator Wallin: Is that for both categories, regular or reserve?
Mr. White: It is both regular and reserve. That change was just instituted in September. Funds from the Poppy Trust Fund are now available to those who are still serving and their families.
Mr. Allard: We recognize that some significant problems exist, even with a still-serving member, especially with split marriages, mental health problems or addiction.
Senator Wallin: Thank you for putting that on the record.
The Deputy Chair: At the parent of this committee, the Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence, which Senator Wallin so ably chairs, we have been tasked with doing some investigation or discussion into the name of our navy, Maritime Command versus Canadian Navy versus Royal Canadian Navy, or anything else we suggest. We have been asked to look at that issue. Maybe we will have you back to that committee for your opinion. However, I want to give you an opportunity today to tell us if the legion, at this time, has an opinion on the name for the navy.
Mr. White: I can see by the red light that we are still on the record.
The Deputy Chair: Yes, we are.
Mr. White: It has been an interesting debate within the Royal Canadian Legion. It has been occurring for years, whether to return to the historical titles of the Royal Canadian Navy and the Royal Canadian Air Force. A resolution was presented to our conference in June, in Winnipeg. We spoke to that resolution through our defence committee and spoke to the delegates on the floor.
In summary, our explanation was that the Canadian Forces have evolved from what they used to be. They are now the Canadian Forces. I am not sure if the members of the Canadian Forces today have a historical tie to old terminology such as the Royal Canadian Air Force and the Royal Canadian Navy.
As we explained to our delegates, today, the members of the Canadian Forces have evolved. We needed to evolve as well, and we did not pass that resolution to advocate on behalf of changing the names back to what they used to be. We recognize them as members of the Canadian Forces. We happen to serve in the army, navy or air force; we understand that.
Mr. Allard: Having lived through unification and the return to the uniforms, when you make changes such as that, it always results in expenses. Those expenses are not dedicated to operations; they are dedicated to administration. That is not the way the Canadian Forces need to go in the future.
The Deputy Chair: I am sure that is music to the ears of some around the table.
I would like to end on that happy note. Thank you for your presentation here today.
Senator Rompkey: Thank you for raising it.
The Deputy Chair: It has been a wonderful experience. It is the parent committee that is dealing with it.
Thank you very much.
(The committee adjourned.)