Skip to content

Commissioner for Children and Youth in Canada Bill

Second Reading--Debate Adjourned

June 22, 2020


Moved second reading of Bill S-217, An Act to establish the Office of the Commissioner for Children and Youth in Canada.

She said: Honourable senators, it is a great honour to speak at second reading as sponsor of Bill S-217, An Act to establish the Office of the Commissioner for Children and Youth in Canada.

. . . I have been waiting for this moment for a very long time, and I believe most Canadians have been waiting for this moment for a long time as well, the opportunity for Parliament to debate and eventually vote for the creation of a national commissioner for children and young persons.

These words were spoken eight years ago by then MP Marc Garneau when he spoke at second reading on his bill, Bill C-420, An Act to establish the Office of the Commissioner for Children and Young Persons in Canada.

Today, I repeat these words to express this same sentiment, but with it, I must express my profound disappointment that almost 30 years after the ratification of the Convention on the Rights of the Child, we still do not have a commissioner for children and youth, and we have not done nearly enough for children. Today, I will elaborate on the mandate of this office and the value it will produce for all Canadians, but before I do this, honourable senators, I think it’s important to speak to you about the need for urgency and why we must make this bill a priority for our children and youth.

Colleagues, Canadian children are in a state of crisis and have been for decades. The data before us are really quite shocking. Accidents are the leading cause of death for our children. We know that thousands of children in Canada die every year due to preventable injuries. We know that the second highest cause of death is suicide. We know that one in three children are victims of abuse and that one in five live in poverty. We know that 1 in 10 children experience food insecurity.

First Nations, Métis and Inuit children are in crisis, as well. A 2019 report by the Assembly of First Nations found that 47% of First Nations children living on reserve live in poverty. When it comes to overall health and quality of life, over 25% of our children and youth are obese. Hospital visits for mental health concerns are rising.

When it comes to the health and well-being of children, our global ranking in Canada has been slipping. We rank twenty-fifth out of 41 OECD countries on measures with respect to the children’s health and well-being, according to UNICEF’s well-being report card. This represents a significant decrease from our 12th-place ranking in 2007.

One troubling sign is a rising rate of infant mortality. Whereas decades ago we were leaders, today our infants are dying at a rate that is amongst the highest in OECD countries, with Nunavut’s rate being three times the national average. Children are the most vulnerable among us. They must depend on their parents, on their guardians, teachers, coaches and other members of their community to be their voice, and to provide them with protection and care. As parliamentarians, we need to make the well-being and future of children our priority.

Senators, the statistics demonstrate that we are failing, and the image they reveal is quite shocking, but what is more disturbing is our inaction. Each of us know children who are affected, have seen them in our communities, we have heard their stories and we have seen the statistics come to life. These are Canada’s children and we can no longer ignore this crisis. It is happening before us and we must ask ourselves how we can act, what we will do in response.

Senators, in this bill I seek to propose a solution that is entirely reasonable, based on a principle that is entirely reasonable. Regardless of where the child is born, their ethnicity, race, sexual orientation, gender or level of physical and mental ability, children and youth are our most precious resource. They are gifts and deserving of every opportunity to grow, thrive and succeed, and we have an obligation to do everything we can to make Canada the best place to be a kid.

So this is where the child commissioner comes in. No, this is not a magic bullet that will solve all the problems that our children face, but it is designed to make immediate and important changes to all policy discourse while we continue to work on the broader systemic changes. The commissioner, as designed in this bill, is to address three main areas of action: To act as an independent officer of Parliament whose role will be to hold Parliament accountable in regards to its obligations for the well-being of children and youth, and to ensure that their rights are respected; to collaborate with various levels of government and communities, to work on behalf of children and youth to advocate for their needs; and to elevate the voice of children and youth in the political discourse.

Honourable senators, it will come as no surprise to many of you that the topic of the child commissioner has long been discussed and debated here in Canada. Unfortunately, for too long, we have shirked our obligations to children under the Convention on the Rights of the Child. The time has come for change.

Historically, Canada has been a beacon for human rights internationally. Look no further than our role in establishing the world’s first large-scale armed peacekeeping force in response to the 1956 Suez Canal Crisis. This effort was led by Canada’s Secretary of State for External Affairs, and future Prime Minister, Lester B. Pearson.

When we think of children’s rights, we must shift our focus to another Pearson. One who in her pivotal roles on behalf Canada’s children, the honourable Landon Pearson, was the vice-chair of the Canadian Commission for the International Year of the Child, in 1979. Canada was then known as a leader in children’s rights.

When the Convention on the Rights of the Child was concluded, we were swift in our adoption and ratification. Following ratification, the UN has come back to us and continued to advise our leadership about the convention and on its implementation. Their advice to Canada was centred around one key recommendation; that Canada establish the role of a federal commissioner. Since these reports were tabled and these recommendations were made some 25 years ago, the critical issues that were highlighted then continue and have gotten worse. We have fallen asleep at the wheel, and colleagues, it is time that we wake up and that we act.

The United Nations has been an important voice in calling Canada to establish a commission for children and youth, but they have not been the only voice. There have been strong and consistent voices from here within Canada, calling for this action.

Honourable senators, within the Senate three of our colleagues, Senators Lovelace Nicholas, Jaffer and Munson, have worked tirelessly to recommend and advance action in this area. Their work as members of the Standing Senate Committee on Human Rights studied children’s rights and published a Senate report back in 2007 titled The Silenced Citizens. I will read two excerpts from this report.

The Committee quickly realized that one of its primary proposals should be the establishment of a Children’s Commissioner at the federal level in Canada to “promote responsible and good governance, and provide a seamless service delivery to children.” Almost every witness who appeared before the Committee, whether independent experts, advocates for children’s rights, or those linked to the UN, supported the establishment of such a monitoring and facilitating body.

Such as the commissioner.

Honourable colleagues, for 13 years we have recognized as an institution what we should be doing. Now it is time to act. In 2009, following this report, current Minister Marc Garneau introduced a bill to create a child commissioner. This ended in defeat in the other place in 2012. Understanding the urgency of this unfinished business, other MPs, MP Cotler, Quach and Leitch, all introduced bills that died on the Order Paper. There have been too many failed attempts. Collectively we have failed as Canadians, and this is a stain on our leadership as parliamentarians.

Many in Canada have called for and continue to call for a commissioner for youth and children. As early as 1991, the Canadian Coalition on the Rights of Children called for a child commissioner. In 2010 UNICEF Canada published a report calling for a federal child commissioner. They stated that:

An independent national Children’s Commissioner would put children’s best interests on the public agenda, encourage different departments and orders of government to coordinate their efforts and promote better laws, policies and services for children.

In 2016 Children First, Canada’s landmark report on the state of Canada’s children, recommended the creation of a federal child commissioner. In 2018 the Canadian Bar Association wrote a letter to the Prime Minister proposing the creation of a commissioner. In 2019 the final report of the Inquiry on Missing and Murdered Indigenous Women and Girls called for a Call for Justice 12.9, calling for a commissioner in every province, territory and one at the federal level.

Again in 2019, the Canadian Coalition of Youth Advocates, the organization that unites provincial and territorial child and youth advocates across Canada, all called for the child commissioner. In their statement made in March of last year they said:

For years, we have called for the creation of an independent parliamentary officer with a focus on Indigenous children, young people migrating to Canada, and those involved with youth justice, health, and mental health systems. There are still too many children who fall outside of our legislated mandates as they rely on federally-funded services. The lack of rights-based resources for these young people is glaring. This is despite the commitments made to all children in Canada through our ratification of the UNCRC nearly 30 years ago.

May I remind you that in 2021 we face the next review by the United Nations on our implementation of the Convention on the Rights of the Child.

Many Canadian organizations have shared with us their reports assessing the state of Canada’s implementation of the convention, and for all of these organizations the establishment of the commissioner for children and youth is a central and important recommendation. If Canada is to faithfully implement the Convention on the Rights of the Child and play its role as an international human rights leader, we must establish an independent voice for children and youth. We have always known this, and now it’s time to act.

Honourable senators, this is unfinished business. As we consider our next steps, I urge us to be united in this challenge. As Marc Garneau said in 2012, “There is no room for partisanship today, especially when we are talking about something as important as our children.”

Today I propose to you that the commissioner for children and youth should be our first step in addressing the crisis facing children here in Canada.

Here are my reasons: The provinces want this. Individual child commissioners and advocates across Canada, and the Canadian coalition of youth advocates, wholeheartedly endorse the federal commissioner for children and youth. They want a federal partner who can facilitate their communication with Ottawa and help share best practices throughout the country, and they have wanted this for a while. They see the federal commissioner working closely with the provinces and territories to partner on the many issues that face our children in their provincial jurisdictions. They hope that the federal commissioner could help Canada move toward greater equity in terms of the well-being of children and building a sustainable long-term strategy and vision for Canadian children.

In our discussions with them, they said they want the federal commissioner to be their voice at the federal level; to set a national vision to monitor policy; and to provide Canadians with a broader and clearer view of the impact policy-makers have on our kids. Child commissioners and advocates across Canada see the commissioner as partnering with them to help advance best practices and achieve national adoption. They see the federal commissioner as partnering with them to draw attention to national issues that require provincial and federal cooperation. They also see that this partnership can be developed without a federal commissioner encroaching on provincial jurisdiction.

Honourable senators, we know that this level of collaboration can and will be core to this role. It will be extremely powerful and impactful.

Here in Canada, there are many wonderful organizations and individuals who have been champions for children’s rights. Every one of these individuals and groups acknowledge that they cannot provide the same level of influence and impact as could an independent officer of Parliament.

We have heard from many of these individuals and organizations who advocate on behalf of children that many Canadians are not aware of the crisis that our children are enduring. They hope that the commissioner for children and youth would be a powerful voice to bring focus to this crisis, to raise the level of dialogue in Canada about the crisis, to amplify their voices and to be an advocate for children — an advocate who would bring focus, amplify awareness, and study and report on issues such as food insecurity and poverty; an advocate who would provide critical analysis of government action as a trusted and respected source; an advocate who would evaluate the impact of policy and legislation on the everyday lives of our children, especially on First Nations, Métis, Inuit and refugee children and youth, who all fall under federal jurisdiction.

They identify the need for an advocate who would highlight the poor outcomes of failed initiatives; an advocate who would provide oversight for the implementation of the Convention on the Rights of the Child.

They point out that, where we worry that Canadians are blinded to the struggle to address the crisis that our children are living, the advocacy of the commissioner would shift the national consciousness toward raising awareness and would make us a more child-friendly country.

They point out that it is unreasonable for us to entrust this responsibility to not-for-profits and civil society. It should be the core responsibility of the federal commissioner for children and youth.

We have heard repeatedly that there is no public officer in our federal government with the obligation to speak to children, to seek their views and to hear directly from them on the issues that affect them and the effect that our actions have on their lives. We heard that we need to establish an effective way for children and youth to share their views and to amplify their voices.

They proposed that an important part of the commissioner’s advocacy would be to directly engage with children and youth so we can hear directly from them what they are going through, and to provide them with a means to raise their own solutions. Children’s solutions to children’s problems should be heard, considered and, when appropriate, acted upon. This would be a core responsibility of the federal commissioner.

Colleagues, we have a lot of tools, mechanisms and vehicles available within the government that are directly aimed at helping children. However, we know that none of them go far enough, and none of them have enough collective influence or reach to address the issues we face. We have a Minister of Families, Children and Social Development, but we know that, despite their best intentions, policy and direction will be guided more by political obligation to the sitting government and by the mandate shaped by the political leadership than by the pressing needs of Canadian children.

We have the public service but, again, its direction is guided by politically oriented leadership. We have the poverty council, on which there is a seat reserved for a child-focused individual. Again, the lack of reach and limitation of its mandate prevents effective engagement. A federal commissioner would provide a broader mandate, influence and reach in his or her role as an advocate.

The role of commissioner for children and youth would be strengthened by powers appropriate to its mandate: the right to intervene in court on behalf of a child or as a friend of the court; the right to visit, without warning, juvenile centres and other institutions that house youth; and the ability to compel the sharing of information. These powers are fundamental to ensuring that the office of the commissioner can carry out its mandate.

I put it to you that children deserve more than incomplete, fragmented and ineffective solutions. They deserve to be considered as a priority, and we should be building solutions based on a long-term vision and strategy for them.

Most important, colleagues, Canadians have spoken on this. They want a commissioner for children and youth. A recent poll commissioned by Children’s Healthcare Canada found that 73% of Canadians support the creation of this role. There is a broad belief in the public that the current system is not serving our children very well, nor is it providing them with a voice.

In our discourse, we also met with the Inuit Tapiriit Kanatami, Native Women’s Association of Canada, and Métis Nation of Alberta. We have conducted online webinars with youth groups to generate discussion and we have spoken to commissioners in other international jurisdictions. The establishment of a federal commissioner for children and youth is strongly supported and seen by all as urgently needed.

I wanted to provide a living example of how it works. The model of the Children’s Commissioner in New Zealand can teach us two lessons. The first is when New Zealand was going through a serious child poverty crisis in the early 2010s, it became clear that discussing the issue was not really the interest of the government of the day. Understanding that there would be no action, the Children’s Commissioner then decided to adopt a strategy to address the issue while allowing the political and bureaucratic ranks the opportunity to catch up. The office put in place a campaign to raise public awareness and to make it an issue that the general public understood and was mobilized on. The issue became a flashpoint for the upcoming election and was adopted by all party platforms. Once the new prime minister was sworn in, the commissioner became the main contributor to the child poverty reduction strategy and was positioned to inform the government. Through his advocacy, New Zealand’s Children’s Commissioner brought attention to child poverty when politicians throughout the country were ignoring it.

The second example has to do with education reform in New Zealand. In response to issues that were occurring in that country, online consultations were used to target the broader public. Meanwhile, the Children’s Commissioner focused on in-person interviews of children from marginalized groups, such as the Maori, the Indigenous people of New Zealand. The children had a lot to say when asked. They spoke about how the current system had failed them. They spoke about racism and discrimination and the impacts of poverty and food insecurity on their education. The final report ended up being the driving force behind education reform in New Zealand, including policies on racism and discrimination, through hearing the voices of children.

I’ll spend a few minutes talking about the bill. The role of the commissioner as designed in this bill is to address three main priorities: to act as an independent officer of Parliament whose concern would be holding Parliament accountable in regard to its obligations on the well-being of children and youth and the respect of their rights; to collaborate with various levels of government and communities to work on behalf of children and youth and to advocate for their needs; and to elevate the voices of children and youth in the political discourse.

The most important principle that applies to this role is the principle of independence. It is essential for this officer to be independent, to have the capacity to function independently and to use this independence to achieve meaningful advocacy.

The work of the commissioner should be driven by evidence, not by politics. All Canadians must be able to trust that the government of the day does not have the ability to influence the commissioner and that the commissioner can be relied upon to hold the government to account.

We have examples of commissioners who are independent here in Canada whose independence led to meaningful advocacy; case in point, the Commissioner of Official Languages. We have examples of independence leading to strong accountability; cases in point, the Parliamentary Budget Officer or the Privacy Commissioner.

The commissioner for children and youth should be able to look past the politics of the day to focus on the long-term needs of children and youth and to bring them to the attention of Parliament. For these reasons, the commissioner for children and youth is best positioned as an independent officer. That was emphasized in the 2007 Senate report as well.

Honourable senators, if we are to make sure that this office has the power it needs to operate, it must be an independent office.

Now, the purpose of the office’s independence is to ensure it can carry out its function, which includes reviewing and reporting on policy instruments such as legislation. The first and key role of the commissioner will be to exercise oversight on government legislation and to consider the rights and well-being of children in this regard.

I believe we all agree that children and youth are too important to our future as a country to remain sidelined in our legislative process. It is imperative that we develop processes that make sure that children and youth get the proper consideration in the creation of all policy and legislation.

The commissioner would examine every piece of legislation, every change in regulation, every exercise of a policy instrument and, where appropriate, comment or report on the impacts of a specific action on Canadian children.

The child commissioner would also have the mandate to assist the government in drafting legislation and to collaborate with the public service to provide information. The commissioner would be a resource for committees and be present to advise parliamentarians in other spheres of their work, enabling us to receive timely and current evidence and information on the state of Canadian children.

Our own Senate committee report also spoke to this. They stated:

All witnesses in support of such a body emphasized that the Children’s Commissioner should conduct ongoing examinations of federal legislation, services, and funding for programs affecting children and their rights — making ‘recommendations, assessments and criticisms’ . . . .

The second key role of the commissioner would be to engage communities and provinces. In this role, the commissioner would advocate, support and expand on the work of provincial partners and would bring to national focus issues that are affecting the provinces, territories and nations.

One of the important aspects of the role would be the mandate to engage with First Nations, Métis and Inuit peoples. Our federal government has specific obligations under the Constitution towards Indigenous children and youth, but it has failed in its obligations. The commissioner for children and youth would address this failure, bringing measurable improvements to the nation-to-nation relationship between the Indigenous peoples of Canada and the federal government.

The commissioner would address some of the recommendations of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission and some of the Calls for Justice from the National Inquiry into Missing and Murdered Indigenous Women and Girls. In this role, the office could provide a bridge to the federal government specifically on children’s issues when called upon.

The history of the Canadian government and Indigenous children is filled with tragedies, injustices and violations of human rights that have led to trauma being passed on for many generations. In crafting this bill, it was my intention to stay away from the colonial practices of the past and to move towards a mutually respectful relationship.

We have spent countless hours discussing this bill with our colleagues in Indigenous nations throughout the country to learn their perspectives on this role, and we will continue to reach out more broadly. I look forward to the committee stage to hear from witnesses and to make changes as we see fit.

The bill will guide the interaction of the children’s commissioner with all nations and Indigenous peoples. The commissioner will acknowledge nations’ independence and assist them when called upon. The commissioner will be knowledgeable about communities, be sensitive to their cultures and practices and will assist communities in the preservation of their culture and languages.

Our expectation of the office of the children’s commissioner is that staffing will reflect the diversity of Canadian communities and that First Nations, Métis and Inuit individuals will be placed in senior roles within the office. I would even go further and recommend that the government consider appointing an Indigenous individual as the first commissioner for children and youth. The commissioner would be an important voice and a long-lasting partner who could strengthen nation-to-nation relationships.

The third key aspect to the commissioner’s role is the elevation of the voices of children and youth in political discourse. Children deserve to be heard, yet their voices are often ignored and forgotten. We must listen to children, hear their problems and their solutions to their problems. We must create a safe space for them to share their concerns, and we must give them access to continuing dialogue about their future.

The commissioner’s engagement would include efforts to draw out the issues of concern for young Canadians through online and in-person engagement. The commissioner would go to children to hear their voices, meeting children in difficult circumstances such as juvenile detention centres and other care institutions. The commissioner would interact with those who care for and serve the interests of children to better understand their needs and the issues they face.

The core of this idea of engagement is the core role of the commissioner in seeking children’s thoughts on children’s issues, to find solutions arising from children. Our children cannot participate or vote in the democratic process. Therefore, a commissioner would be a constant way to make sure that their voice is amplified. When children are allowed to speak, we will relish the sound of their voices.

Colleagues, Canadian children ought to be aware of their rights. The commissioner for children and youth will have the responsibility, not only to educate children on their rights, but will have the responsibility to educate all Canadians on the Convention on the Rights of the Child. This would be a core activity for the office’s community interactions and also a specific recommendation of the 2007 Senate report.

This, senators, is how we would build a society better suited for our children.

Across our country, Canadians are grappling with a new reality that is rapidly changing our lives. The COVID-19 pandemic has brought the issues facing our children and youth into sharp focus. It has unmasked the unique ways that children are made vulnerable, and the urgent need to put in place immediately the resources, supports and protections that have been missing for all Canadian children.

In so many ways, it has deepened the crisis that they face. COVID-19 has only made things worse for our kids. Food insecurity, domestic abuse, interruptions to their daily routines and education are among some of the more severe issues that our children have confronted. But we struggle to know to what extent or what future impact this will have on children because we don’t have their voices. We are not listening.

Children, we need a commissioner for times like these so that we can hear your voice and understand the impact of what is happening in your world, on you.

This is why I chose to introduce this bill and to make this speech today. Those who argue that we are currently considering priority emergency legislation alone miss one glaring truth: For all children, this is emergency legislation.

Senators, today we owe Canadian children three things: our obligation, our urgency and our action. We must recognize the power and the responsibility that we as parliamentarians hold to address these problems. This is our obligation. Together, we must realize the urgency of the problems that Canadian children and youth face. And most importantly, together we must move to action.

Today in Canada, we have an opportunity to make sure that every child — every Canadian child — has every opportunity to thrive in this land. Although this bill will not solve all our problems, it would be one of the most significant steps that we as a Parliament will have taken in a long time, and we must take that step together.

This commissioner for children and youth will advocate for our children, hold the government accountable, give voice to our children and work with our communities when called upon to make sure that protections for them are in place.

Colleagues, my team and I have spent months working on this bill — and I thank them — and reflecting on what we have heard. Working with members of our public sector, not-for-profits and civil society groups, we have developed the bill you see in front of you. We welcome the dialogue that we’ll have as we examine this bill, and I happily invite your questions, comments and amendments once we get to committee.

I encourage you to vote for this bill and support its passage. Together, let us give children and youth the voice they deserve and need. Let us show communities that we care enough to give them the resources they ask for, for their children. Let us show Indigenous Canadians that we respect them as nations and that we are serious about working towards repairing the harms of colonialism. Let us show the world that we are serious about our human rights obligations. And let us show Canadians that in a true democracy, we are not afraid of accountability, that we welcome honest scrutiny. Let us show children and youth that in Ottawa, there are people who care and listen, and ready to do what we know — and have known for a long time — is the right thing to do.

This is why I joined the Senate. This is the change that I want to make. Please join me on this journey. Thank you.

Hon. Pierrette Ringuette (The Hon. the Acting Speaker) [ + ]

Question, senator? Would Senator Moodie accept a question?

Hon. Jim Munson [ + ]

Thank you, Senator Moodie. I do have a quick question for you. My goodness, have you done your homework. It is refreshing and wonderful to see.

If there is one thing I would like to see before I leave this chamber in a year from now, it is a children’s commissioner. We’ve been fighting for this since, as you said, our 2007 report. There always seems to be an appetite for a children’s commissioner for a while and then it disappears. People become cabinet ministers and sometimes the focus is not there any more. Close to 70 countries have a children’s commissioner of some sort.

Just a very quick question and I will speak to this course. Where do disabled children fit in the role of a children’s commissioner and their rights?

Thank you, Senator Munson, for your question. Part of the role of the commissioner, and an integral part of the role of the commissioner, is to elevate from the provincial level of child advocates and commissioners, the best practices, the best approaches that they can elevate to the national level and, therefore, spread across jurisdictions.

One opportunity for the commissioner is to bring to the bigger forum, to Canada as a whole, opportunities that are not widespread. I think the counter of that would be where very poor conditions exist for a particular group of children, such as disabled children. If this were across many regions, it could become an issue that, it being a systemic issue, that the commissioner could address.

I think there are opportunities on both sides of the coin: to spread the good and to highlight the issues that are occurring.

Senator Munson [ + ]

I have many questions, but I see we have about three minutes to go in terms of the questions.

Some of the idea of a national commissioner, to use the term “national commissioner,” sometimes there has been a little pushback in the province of Quebec of having a national commissioner dealing with the rights of children in the province of Quebec. Have you consulted the Province of Quebec and other provinces that have provincial ombudspersons dealing with children’s rights and so on, and has there been a buy-in from all the provinces?

Again, thank you for your question. In fact, part of the very deliberate and in-depth work that we did was to speak to every child commissioner that we could get in touch with, and one of the commissioners that we spoke to was the commissioner representing children in Quebec.

We had a strong level of support across the board. Commissioners feel that this has been that link, that added step, that person that would partner with them to make sure that they were able to bring things to the federal level that they currently cannot. We have strong support, as I said, in Quebec. The folks that we spoke to are currently very supportive of the idea of a commissioner at the national level.

The Hon. the Acting Speaker [ + ]

Senator Munson, do you have another question?

Senator Munson [ + ]

Yes, we do need a children’s commissioner in this country. There is a minority Parliament dealing with these issues and we all want to get involved with the debate. This has to pass here, and then it has to pass over on the House side. Then hopefully it will become law before a minority government falls or lives out its mandate.

Should there be a minister within the context of a children’s commissioner? I know the Prime Minister took on youth and there is a Minister of Families, Children and Social Development, but should there be a specific minister dealing with youth so that the commissioner that has to report to Parliament can also deal directly with a youth ministry federally?

Again, thank you for your question.

When we look at the state of play across Canada, there are a number of ministries that support and have the responsibility for children as part of their mandate. In fact, there were a number of initiatives over the past few years where children’s representatives have been embedded in various groups and committees within ministries to be that voice. Again, the limitation of the individuals in those roles that we found when we looked closely was their mandate, their reach beyond their committee and their reach beyond the ministry. In fact, in doing some of this work, we’ve reached out across four ministries to talk to people because that’s the state of play.

The Hon. the Acting Speaker [ + ]

Senator Moodie, your time has expired.

Back to top