Proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on
National Security and Defence
Issue 6 - Evidence
OTTAWA, Wednesday, December 11, 2002
The Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence met this day at 1:10 p.m. to examine the proposal of the Valiants Group for the erection of statues in downtown Ottawa to salute the heroic wartime sacrifice of certain valiant men and women who fought victoriously for the independence of Canada during the 17th, 18th, 19th and 20th centuries, and helped mightily to establish Canada's nationhood; and to consider a draft report.
Senator Colin Kenny (Chairman) in the Chair.
[English]
The Chairman: We have before us a report from the Subcommittee on Veterans Affairs.
Senator Meighen: Mr. Chairman, the Subcommittee on Veterans Affairs heard from the Valiants Group earlier this morning. Having heard their testimony, we recommend that the Government of Canada reconsider the Valiants project, taking into account the proposals of the sponsors to reduce the number of statues, alter the choice of Valiants and lower the costs.
The full report is here.
Senator Forrestall: Shall we accept the report and instruct the chair of the subcommittee to prepare an appropriate letter?
The Chairman: We have a motion before us. If you would like to have a discussion about what steps should be taken if this report is adopted by the full committee, it is appropriate to do so now.
Senator Forrestall: My comments have to do with appropriate procedure. We have received a report from the subcommittee and we must deal with that report. Our options are to file it or to take action upon it; correct?
The Chairman: Or to take it to the chamber.
Senator Forrestall: How would you suggest we proceed?
The Chairman: If we accept the report now, I would suggest that the chair of the subcommittee or a designate table it in the chamber this afternoon.
Do we need to give notice?
Ms. Barbara Reynolds, Clerk of the Committee: For the purposes of translation, I would suggest that it be tabled tomorrow.
The Chairman: Are there other comments that senators would like to make with regard to other communications to the ministers involved, aside from submitting the report to the Senate?
Senator Day: I would agree with that.
Senator Atkins: Could we ask the ministers whether it would be accepted if the Valiants Group were to pay for the total cost of this?
The Chairman: If I understood the testimony we heard, the Valiants Group has not contemplated that.
Senator Atkins: I know they have not. However, I wonder whether, if the question were put to the ministers, they would have any objection.
Senator Meighen: I did not hear any testimony to that effect, although I understand your point, Senator Atkins. The testimony was to the effect that money did not seem to be an important stumbling block.
Senator Atkins: I am not so sure of that, though.
Senator Meighen: The Valiants Group has indicated that they are ready to raise 20 per cent of the cost. The costs can be further reduced if it were agreed — and I am not suggesting it should or should not be; that is an issue to be dealt with between the Valiants Group and the government — that there be fewer statues.
Senator Atkins: My point is that the fact that they are asking Canadian Heritage to pay 80 per cent of the cost gives them the authority to object.
The Chairman: I understand your point. Senator Meighen went through the issue of location, which appears to have been resolved with the NCC. Your point is that if there is no funding involved then Canadian Heritage should not have any say in the matter.
Senator Atkins: Exactly.
The Chairman: If that is the case, then you do not need to put the offer to them, you just take the funding.
Senator Atkins: That is right.
The Chairman: I do not think that is on the table. Frankly, to have this group come forward and make the effort that they are doing now is quite significant. To have increased their offer from 15 per cent to 20 per cent strikes me as being significant.
Senator Atkins: I do not want to minimize their effort.
The Chairman: If the Valiants Group had 100 per cent of the money, they would not have to go to Canadian Heritage, so why put the question to them? The issue is that Canadian Heritage does not like the balance. They do not like the fact of it being war heroes. What I find bizarre is Canadian Heritage's plans to come up with other commemorations. This country lacks its historical figures. If there is anything that seems glaringly obvious, it is that we have a shortage of such commemorations. What we have here is a private-sector group that has come forward with an idea that accomplishes the goal in one area. You would think that if Canadian Heritage were focusing on this they would come forward with complementary proposals that would cover off other areas. We should be conveying that message back to the department, in addition to what we have here in the report.
Senator Day: Mr. Chairman, it would be dangerous to even suggest 100 per cent private-sector funding in a letter. That could create expectations that might cause this project not to proceed.
Having said that, Senator Atkins may well have his opportunity, if we do not get the type of response through a debate in the chamber and through the letters that we intend to send out. If we do not get an appropriate response, then the next step for the subcommittee should be to bring the various ministers in here and find out whether this is a ministerial decision or a deputy ministerial decision. At that point, Senator Atkins will have a chance to ask the question.
Senator Meighen: That is well said. If we proceed as outlined we do not forego the option that Senator Atkins would like to exercise. He will be able to do it in due course, if necessary.
The Chairman: Honourable senators, there is a motion before us that we adopt the report of the Subcommittee on Veterans Affairs. Is it agreed?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chairman: Opposed?
Is there any other business before the committee at this time?
If not, then I should like to thank colleagues, as well as Mr. Southam and his group for attending here and giving us an opportunity to deal with this issue.
The committee adjourned.