Proceedings of the Standing Committee on
Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration
Issue 3 - Minutes of Proceedings
OTTAWA, Tuesday, February 4, 2003
(11)
The Standing Senate Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration met in camera at 10:07 a.m. this day, the Honourable Senator Bacon (Chair) presiding.
Members of the committee present: The Honourable Senators Atkins, Bacon, Gauthier, Gill, Kroft, Robichaud, P.C., and Stratton (7).
In attendance: Mr. Paul C. Bélisle, Clerk of the Senate and other senior Senate officials.
At 10:32 a.m., the committee adjourned at the call of the Chair.
ATTEST:
OTTAWA, Thursday, February 13, 2003
(12)
The Standing Senate Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration met at 9:10 a.m. this day, the Honourable Senator Bacon (Chair) presiding.
Members of the committee present: The Honourable Senators Bacon, Bryden, De Bané, P.C., Gauthier, Gill, Jaffer, Kinsella, Kroft, Lynch-Staunton, Poulin, Robichaud P.C. and Stratton (12).
Other senators in attendance: The Honourable Senators Banks, Kenny, Prud'homme P.C., and Stollery (4).
Also in attendance: Mr. Paul C. Bélisle, Clerk of the Senate and other senior Senate officials.
2003-02-13/045 — Adoption of Minutes of Proceedings
Senator Kroft noted that the Minutes of November 28, 2002 should indicate that Senator Mahovlich was appointed as an additional member of the Artwork Advisory Working Group and not that he would be replacing Senator Moore as a member of that Working Group.
After debate, it was agreed that the Minutes of Proceedings of December 5, December 10, December 12, 2002 and February 4, 2003 be adopted as presented and that the Minutes of Proceedings of November 28, 2002 be adopted with the following modification.
2002-11-28/038 — Artwork Advisory Working Group
The Chair informed the committee that Senator Mahovlich has been appointed as a member of the Artwork Advisory Working Group.
2003-02-13/046 — Fourth Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure
Senator Bacon presented the Fourth Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure (Steering Committee) as follows:
Thursday, February 13, 2003
The Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure of the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration has the honour to present its
FOURTH REPORT
Your Subcommittee considered the budget submissions from the following committees:
Foreign Affairs (legislation)
National Security and Defence
(special study — Veterans Affairs)Scrutiny of Regulations (Joint Committee)
Social Affairs, Science and Technology
(special study — mental health)National Security and Defence (special study)
Your Subcommittee recommends the release of the following amounts for fiscal year 2002-2003:
1. Foreign Affairs (Legislation)
Professional and Other Services
$ 1,750
Transportation and Communications
$ 500
Other Expenditures
$ 500
Total
$ 2,750
2. National Security and Defence (Special Study - Veterans Affairs)
Professional and Other Services
$ 1,850
Transportation and Communications
$ 100
Other Expenditures
$ 50
Total
$ 2,000
3. Scrutiny of Regulations (Joint Committee)
Professional and Other Services
$ 40,800
Transportation and Communications
$ 1,350
Other Expenditures
$ 1,770
Total
$ 43,920
4. Social Affairs, Science and Technology (special study — mental health)
Professional and Other Services
$ 7,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 17,200
Other Expenditures
$ 2,400
Total
$ 26,600
Your Subcommittee recommends the release of the following additional amounts for fiscal year 2002-2003:
5. National Security and Defence (special study)
Professional and Other Services
$ 0
Transportation and Communications
$ 36,000
Other Expenditures
$ 0
Total
$ 36,000
These recommended releases amounts to a total of $111,270.
Respectfully submitted,
LISE BACON
Chair
Senator Gauthier moved that the Report be adopted.
Senator De Bané proposed an amendment to item 5 (National Security and Defence - Special Study) to increase the total amount from $ 36,000 to $ 69,000 for additional travel expenses and to hire a special advisor.
After debate, it was agreed that the Fourth Report be adopted as presented.
Senator Kroft moved, seconded by Senator Jaffer, that the Steering Committee be empowered to examine committee requirements for additional funds before the end of the fiscal year, and make the allocations accordingly.
The question being put on the motion, it was — Resolved in the affirmative.
2003-02-13/047 — Security Advisory Working Group
The Chair proposed that a Security Advisory Working Group (SAWG) be created and that it be composed of Senators Bryden (Chair), Gauthier and Meighen.
After debate, it was agreed that an Security Advisory Working Group be established and that it be authorized to:
- review and make recommendations regarding the normalization of 13 person years within the Senate Protective Service;
- review and make recommendations regarding the possible establishment of an armed unit within the Senate Protective Service; and
- consider other parliamentary security matters
It was also agreed that the Security Advisory Working Group be directed to report back to the committee no later than March 31, 2003.
2003-02-13/048 — CPAC
The Chair reported on her meeting of February 11, 2003 with Ms. Colette Watson, President and General Manager of the Canadian Public Affairs Channel (CPAC).
At 10:50 a.m., the committee adjourned at the call of the Chair.
ATTEST:
OTTAWA, Thursday, March 20, 2003
(13)
The Standing Senate Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration met at 9:05 a.m. this day, the Honourable Senator Bacon (Chair) presiding.
Members of the committee present: The Honourable Senators Austin, P.C., Bacon, De Bané, P.C., Gauthier, Gill, Poulin, Robichaud P.C. and Stratton (8).
Other senators in attendance: The Honourable Senator Maheu (1).
Also in attendance: Mr. Paul C. Bélisle, Clerk of the Senate and other senior Senate officials.
2003-03-20/049 — Election of New Deputy Chair
It was moved by Senator Stratton that Senator Robertson be elected Deputy Chair of the Committee and that he would be Acting Deputy Chair until her return to the committee.
The question being put on the motion, it was — Resolved in the affirmative.
2003-03-20/050 — Adoption of Minutes of Proceedings
It was agreed that the Minutes of Proceedings of February 13, 2003 be adopted.
2003-03-20/051 — Sixth Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure — Travel Policy for Senate Committees
Senator Bacon presented the Sixth Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure (Steering Committee) as follows:
Thursday, March 20, 2003
The Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure of the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration has the honour to present its
SIXTH REPORT
The current travel policy for Senate committees includes the following:
Members of a traveling committee and their staff are entitled, for travel within and outside Canada, to a per diem equivalent to the Treasury Board rate or actual expenses accompanied by original receipts.
This policy was adopted in the 38th Report of the Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration on March 29, 1990. It was adopted by the Senate on May 1, 1990.
The current policy has no upper limit or restrictions, seriously compromising accountability.
Your Subcommittee recommends that the policy be amended as follows, to bring in it line with Treasury Board policy:
Where a traveller incurs meal costs that are higher than the established meal allowances in situations outside the traveller's control, the actual and reasonable expenses incurred shall be reimbursed, based on original receipts.
Such a change would improve the policy by allowing a reasonable level of flexibility, while increasing accountability.
Respectfully submitted,
LISE BACON
Chair
After debate, it was agreed that the Sixth Report be adopted as presented.
2003-03-20/052 — Seventh Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure — Banking Committee Budget
Senator Bacon presented the Seventh Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure (Steering Committee) as follows:
Thursday, March 20, 2003
The Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure of the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration has the honour to present its
SEVENTH REPORT
Your Subcommittee recommends the following release of funds with respect to committee budgets for fiscal year 2003-2004.
(a) Standing Senate Committee on Banking, Trade and Commerce (Special Study — Financial Systems)
Professional and Other Services
$ 0
Transportation and Communications
$ 20,000
Other Expenditures
$ 0
Total
$ 20,000
Respectfully submitted,
LISE BACON
Chair
After debate, it was agreed that the Seventh Report be adopted as presented.
2003-03-20/053 — Eighth Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure — Principles to Review Budget Requests
Senator Bacon presented the Eighth Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure (Steering Committee) as follows:
Thursday, March 20, 2003
The Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure of the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration has the honour to present its
EIGHTH REPORT
The consideration of committee budgets is one of the most important tasks undertaken by the Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration. While your Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure has not yet heard from Committee Chairs, we have met to discuss some of the principles that we believe should guide our review of this year's requests.
Budget requests amounting to some $2.2 million have already been received, and a further $1 million in budgets are pending. Given that $1.8 million are available for distribution, some difficult decisions will have to be made.
In fiscal year 2002-2003, the guidelines used by your Subcommittee included restricting funding for fact- finding trips inside Canada to 9 Senators and 3 staff and to 6 Senators and 2 staff outside Canada. While this level of funding was adequate for most committees, some Senators expressed a desire for funding to be at a level which would allow all committee members to travel, whether to attend public hearings or to participate in fact- finding.
Your Subcommittee wishes to facilitate and support the work of committees, while being fiscally responsible. In order to meet these objectives, we should consider, for the next fiscal year, the possibility to allow the level of funding requested by the Committee in its budget. In such a case, surplus funds remaining after the trip is complete would have to be returned for redistribution. While the requirement to return surplus funds has been in place for some time, there has been no active enforcement of this requirement. If committees are to be given the level of funding they request, a strict adherence to this policy will be required. This will enable the Committee on Internal Economy to release funds to support other committee activities later in the fiscal year.
Your Subcommittee will be reviewing carefully each budget submission, and Chairs will be asked to defend their requests and to identify their committee's priorities. It should not be assumed that all trips will be funded. The case will still have to be made, including an explanation of why travel, rather than hearings in Ottawa, are desirable. A cost-benefit analysis is important. Requests for professional services will need to be justified, as will requests for funding to attend conferences.
While your Subcommittee wishes to facilitate the work of committees, it must work within its fiscal framework. Your Subcommittee is confident that it will receive the information it requires to make responsible decisions. We look forward to the cooperation of all Senators in this important endeavor.
Respectfully submitted,
LISE BACON
Chair
After debate, it was agreed that further debate be adjourned until the Steering Committee has met with Committee Chairs.
At 9:40 a.m., the committee proceeded in camera.
At 10:40 a.m., the committee adjourned at the call of the Chair.
ATTEST:
OTTAWA, Thursday, March 27, 2003
(14)
The Standing Senate Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration met in camera at 9:07 a.m. this day, the Honourable Senator Bacon (Chair) presiding.
Members of the committee present: The Honourable Senators Atkins, Austin, P.C., Bacon, Bryden, De Bané, P.C., Gill, Jaffer, Kroft, Poulin, Robichaud P.C. and Stratton (11).
Other senators in attendance: The Honourable Senator Prud'homme, P.C. (1).
Also in attendance: Mr. Paul C. Bélisle, Clerk of the Senate and other senior Senate officials.
At 10:22 a.m., the committee adjourned at the call of the Chair.
ATTEST:
Paul C. Bélisle
Clerk of the Senate and Clerk of the Standing Senate Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration
Gary O'Brien
Recording Secretary
OTTAWA, Thursday, April 3, 2003
(15)
The Standing Senate Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration met at 9:03 a.m. this day, the Honourable Senator Bacon (Chair) presiding.
Members of the committee present: The Honourable Senators Austin, P.C., Bacon, Bryden, De Bané, P.C., Gauthier, Kroft, Poulin, Robichaud, P.C. and Stratton (9).
Other senators in attendance: The Honourable Senator Prud'homme, P.C. (1).
Also in attendance: Mr. Paul C. Bélisle, Clerk of the Senate and other senior Senate officials.
2003-04-03/063 — Ninth Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure
Senator Bacon presented the Ninth Report of the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure (Steering Committee) as follows:
Thursday, April 3, 2003
The Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure of the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration has the honour to present its
NINTH REPORT
Your Subcommittee recommends the following release of funds with respect to committee budgets for fiscal year 2003-2004:
1. Aboriginal People (legislation)
Professional and Other Services
$ 10,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 500
Other Expenditures
$ 700
Total
$ 11,200
2. Aboriginal People (special study — urban youth)
Professional and Other Services
$ 15,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 2,000
Other Expenditures
$ 2,000
Total
$ 19,000
3. Agriculture and Forestry (special study — impact of climate change)
Professional and Other Services
$ 10,800
Transportation and Communications
$ 1,000
Other Expenditures
$ 7,900
Total
$ 19,700
4. Agriculture and Forestry (special study — marketing for value-added products)
Professional and Other Services
$ 69,200
Transportation and Communications
$ 141,180
Other Expenditures
$ 11,300
Total
$ 221,680
(includes funding for public hearings in Ontario and Quebec)
5. Banking, Trade and Commerce (legislation)
Professional and Other Services
$ 23,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 0
Other Expenditures
$ 9,500
Total
$ 32,500
6. Banking, Trade and Commerce (special study —financial system, supplementary release)
Professional and Other Services
$ 33,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 7,000
Other Expenditures
$ 3,000
Total
$ 43,000
(includes some funding for conferences)
7. Banking, Trade and Commerce (special study — bankruptcy and insolvency)
Professional and Other Services
$ 18,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 0
Other Expenditures
$ 3,500
Total
$ 21,500
8. Energy, Environment and Natural Resources (legislation)
Professional and Other Services
$ 7,500
Transportation and Communications
$ 500
Other Expenditures
$ 3,000
Total
$ 11,000
9. Energy, Environment and Natural Resources (special study — emerging issues)
Professional and Other Services
$ 29,800
Transportation and Communications
$ 92,170
Other Expenditures
$ 5,500
Total
$ 127,470
(includes funding for fact-finding in Washington and some funding to attend conferences)
10. Fisheries and Oceans (special study — straddling stocks and fish habitat)
Professional and Other Services
$ 15,100
Transportation and Communications
$ 151,900
Other Expenditures
$ 300
Total
$ 167,300
(includes funding for fact-finding in British Columbia, New Brunswick and Ontario and attendance of one member at an annual meeting)
11. Foreign Affairs (legislation)
Professional and Other Services
$ 3,500
Transportation and Communications
$ 750
Other Expenditures
$ 750
Total
$ 5,000
12. Foreign Affairs (special study — Canada-U.S. & Mexico trade relationship)
Professional and Other Services
$ 37,750
Transportation and Communications
$ 117,700
Other Expenditures
$ 10,000
Total
$ 165,450
(includes funding for fact-finding in Washington, visits to editorial boards, and some funding to attend conferences)
13. Human Rights (special study — possible adherence to the American Convention on Human Rights)
Professional and Other Services
$ 17,500
Transportation and Communications
$ 6,715
Other Expenditures
$ 800
Total
$ 25,015
(includes funding for attendance at a round table in Quebec)
14. Legal and Constitutional Affairs (legislation)
Professional and Other Services
$ 35,500
Transportation and Communications
$ 9,807
Other Expenditures
$ 1,000
Total
$ 46,307
(includes $ 15,000 for professional advice including legal advice. It must be noted that any person hired by the Committee to provide assistance to it can not be given the title of Legal Counsel to the Senate or to the Committee, since the Senate Law Clerk and Parliamentary Counsel is Legal Counsel to all Senate committees.)
15. National Finance (legislation)
Professional and Other Services
$ 25,500
Transportation and Communications
$ 6,000
Other Expenditures
$ 0
Total
$ 31,500
(includes some funding for conferences)
16. National Security and Defence (special study — national security policy)
Professional and Other Services
$ 90,400
Transportation and Communications
$ 79,015
Other Expenditures
$ 11,000
Total
$ 180,415
(includes partial funding for professional services, funding for travel to Halifax, Québec City, and Montreal for public hearings and fact-finding, and some funding for conferences)
17. National Security and Defence (special study — veterans affairs)
Professional and Other Services
$ 4,800
Transportation and Communications
$ 11,800
Other Expenditures
$ 530
Total
$ 17,130
(includes funding for fact-finding travel to Ste-Anne-de-Bellevue and Toronto)
18. Official Languages (special study — operation of the Official Languages Act)
Professional and Other Services
$ 18,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 103,800
Other Expenditures
$ 4,050
Total
$125,850 (includes funding for travel in Western/Central Canada for public hearings and fact-finding)
19. Rules, Procedures and the Rights of Parliament
Professional and Other Services
$ 10,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 500
Other Expenditures
$ 0
Total
$ 10,500
20. Scrutiny of Regulations (Joint Committee)
Professional and Other Services
$ 2,790
Transportation and Communications
$ 2,250
Other Expenditures
$ 2,505
Total
$ 7,545
(includes some funding for conferences)
21. Social Affairs, Science and Technology (legislation)
Professional and Other Services
$ 2,500
Transportation and Communications
$ 0
Other Expenditures
$ 500
Total
$ 3,000
22. Social Affairs, Science and Technology (special study — mental health)
Professional and Other Services
$ 38,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 80,400
Other Expenditures
$ 5,700
Total
$ 124,100
(includes funding for travel to Toronto, Montreal, and Western Canada for public hearings and fact-finding and some funding for conferences)
23. Transport and Communications (legislation)
Professional and Other Services
$ 20,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 200
Other Expenditures
$ 1,000
Total
$ 21,200
24. Transport and Communications (special study — media)
Professional and Other Services
$ 84,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 140,450
Other Expenditures
$ 10,000
Total
$ 240,450
(includes funding for public hearings in Western Canada)
The total release recommended in this report is $ 1,677,812.
Your Subcommittee recommends that there be a strict claw back process, whereby any funds remaining following the conclusion of an activity, in particular travel for public hearings and/or fact-finding, will be returned to the central budget for redistribution by the Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration. This will be done in such a way that committees will not have to volunteer the return of funds.
Your Subcommittee intends to reconvene in the fall to undertake a review of the financial situation and to consider the release of additional funds. The release recommended in this report will enable committees to plan their work at least through the early fall.
Respectfully submitted,
LISE BACON
Chair
Senator Stratton proposed an amendment to item 24 (Transport and Communications — Special Study — media). He asked that, the recommended release be under $ 200,000.
After debate, it was agreed that the Ninth Report be adopted with the following amendment:
24. Transport and Communications (special study - media)
Professional and Other Services
$ 84,000
Transportation and Communications
$ 103,850
Other Expenditures
$ 10,000
Total
$ 197,850
(includes funding for public hearings in Eastern or Western Canada)
The total release recommended in this report is $ 1,635,212
International Travel
Senator Kroft stressed the importance that further consideration be given to Senator Austin's proposal to allow senators to use their travel points for trips to the United States.
The Chair indicated that the Subcommittee on Agenda and Procedure was now in a position to review the proposal since it had disposed of the matter of committee budgets. However, the Subcommittee would also weigh those concerns raised by Senator Robichaud at that same meeting related to the benefits of developing stronger ties to ``la francophonie'' and possibly other countries or clusters of countries.
At 9:45 a.m., the committee adjourned at the call of the Chair.
ATTEST:
Paul C. Bélisle
Clerk of the Senate and Clerk of the Standing Senate Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration
Heather Lank
Recording Secretary