Proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on
Aboriginal Peoples
Issue 13 - Evidence - November 3, 2010
OTTAWA, Wednesday, November 3, 2010
The Standing Senate Committee on Aboriginal Peoples met this day at 6:47 p.m. to examine the progress made on commitments endorsed by Parliamentarians of both chambers since the Government's apology to former students of Indian residential schools.
Senator Gerry St. Germain (Chair) in the chair
[English]
The Chair: Good evening. I welcome honourable senators, members of the public and viewers across the country to the proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on Aboriginal Peoples.
I am Gerry St. Germain, originally from Manitoba but now from British Columbia. I have the honour and privilege of chairing this committee.
The mandate of this committee is to examine legislation and matters relating to the Aboriginal peoples of Canada generally. Today we are meeting on an order of reference that asks us to examine and report on the progress made on commitments endorsed by parliamentarians of both chambers since the government's apology to former students of Indian residential schools.
In June 2008, Prime Minister Harper delivered a statement of apology on behalf of the Canadian government to survivors of Indian residential schools. In the apology, the Prime Minister stated that the entire "policy of assimilation" implemented by the residential school system was wrong and "has caused great harm."
The Prime Minister committed to "moving towards healing, reconciliation and resolution of the sad legacy of residential schools" and to the implementation of the Indian Residential Schools Settlement agreement.
We will likely hear more about this settlement agreement negotiated in May 2006 when we hear testimony from our witness from the Congress of Aboriginal Peoples.
I will introduce the members of the committee who are present this evening: Senator Nancy Greene Raine, from British Columbia; Senator Sandra Lovelace Nicholas, from New Brunswick; Senator Roméo Dallaire, from Quebec; and Senator Salma Ataullahjan, from Ontario.
Senators, please join me in welcoming Betty Ann Lavallée, National Chief of the Congress of Aboriginal Peoples. Ms. Lavallée, please proceed with your presentation, after which we will go to questions from senators.
Betty Ann Lavallée, National Chief, Congress of Aboriginal Peoples: Good evening, Senator St. Germain and members of the Standing Senate Committee on Aboriginal Peoples. It is an honour to speak to this committee on the traditional and unceded territory of the Algonquin people.
I am a status Mi'kmaq woman who has lived all my life off reserve. I am from Geary, New Brunswick, and I am the former chief and president of the New Brunswick Aboriginal Peoples Council. Prior to that, I spent 17 and a half years in the military.
On September 12, 2009, I was elected National Chief of the Congress of Aboriginal Peoples. For 39 years, we have represented the rights and the interests of off-reserve, non-status and status Indians and Metis Aboriginal peoples living in urban, rural, remote and isolated areas throughout Canada.
On behalf of the congress, I wish to honour the resilience and courage of the residential school survivors and their descendants. We recognize their ongoing healing efforts and determination to seek the truth. The congress is committed to and supportive of all Aboriginal efforts to break the intergenerational cycle of dysfunction caused by the residential school experience.
The June 2008 apology by the Government of Canada and all the party leaders established a moral turning point in the history of this country. The collective recognition that a national crime had been committed against Aboriginal peoples needs to be sustained. This moment should lie at the heart of policy-making and be used to stimulate a wider reconciliation process inclusive of all Aboriginal peoples, whether they be status or non-status Indians, Inuit or Metis.
Implementation of the Indian Residential Schools Settlement Agreement began in September 2007. There are five different elements to address the legacy of the schools. They include the Common Experience Payment; the Independent Assessment Process; measures to support healing; commemorative activities; and the Truth and Reconciliation Commission.
We fully support an extension of the settlement agreement to include the Metis and Inuit who attended Indian residential schools. There is no valid reason for excluding these survivors.
The Truth and Reconciliation Commission has a five-year mandate and we think this term needs to be extended. The work of the commission is of particular importance and the issues they are dealing with are not simple. The TRC mandate should be expanded to all victims of the residential school system.
In addition, we do not believe that residential school survivors are fully aware of the Independent Assessment Process for claims of sexual or serious physical harm. In his testimony before this committee, Justice Murray Sinclair emphasized the importance of education in providing answers. The congress supports this view.
Improving educational outcomes for Aboriginal peoples is critically important in poverty reduction strategies. Following our August meeting in Churchill, Manitoba, national Aboriginal leaders and premiers recommended that Prime Minister Harper convene a first ministers' meeting within the next year. This meeting's purpose would include a discussion on concrete ways to ensure quality and culturally appropriate education for all Aboriginal peoples. We call upon this Senate committee to support the initiative.
The negative and pervasive influence of residential schools has touched most Aboriginal peoples. Mental health and well-being are an integral part of overall health. In our holistic view, wellness comes from a balance of the body, mind and spirit, closely tied to cultural identity, self-determination, community, family and, of course, the land. It is my hope that the spirit of reconciliation, combined with a principled approach, will result in a renewed and positive relationship.
The federal government committed substantial resources under the residential school settlement. Health Canada has a budget of $65.9 million for various health supports. The program is available to all former Indian residential school students, regardless of status or place of residence. The supports are also available for family members of Indian residential school survivors. The congress is not engaged in this program. However, some of our affiliate organizations are involved in cultural or emotional support activities.
Our engagement with the Truth and Reconciliation Commission is weak. The TRC has been sponsoring forums with elders to speak about reconciliation, but we are not aware of these forums or how they are being organized.
With regard to the compensation being paid to residential school survivors, Ontario's Justice Winkler called for the compensation to be delivered in an expeditious manner. Unfortunately, there are long delays; it is taking an average of 415 days to handle the appeal process. We do not believe that survivors are aware of the Independent Assessment Process for claims of sexual or serious physical abuse.
The congress is particularly interested in the community commemorative projects and we would like to be engaged in this work. We think that the Holocaust remembrance centres could be a model for the residential schools commemorative centres.
The Aboriginal Healing Foundation's mandate runs until September 2012. Many survivors are still in need of healing supports and that work must be continued. I think everyone here would agree it would be harmful to begin a healing journey and then have it stop because of lack of funding.
We all recognize that bringing closure is at the heart of reconciliation. We all share a commitment and determination to achieve this. The United Nations declared 2009 the International Year of Reconciliation. In the spirit of this process, I encourage senators to support the call to have the years 2011 to 2020 declared the "global reconciliation decade." We believe that this would be a worthy and symbolic measure of Canada's support on the international stage.
We ask every senator on this committee to join us in the struggle to right the wrongs of the past so that we may have a better future.
The Chair: Thank you for your excellent presentation. We will go to Senator Campbell, followed by Senator Dallaire.
Senator Campbell: I apologize for my tardiness. The time escaped me, as sometimes happens here.
The Chair: You work too hard, sir. Slow down.
Senator Campbell: I have two questions. First, in October we had the president of the Native Women's Association of Canada come before us with a recommendation of the establishment of two additional sub-commissions as part of the truth and reconciliation process. One was a youth sub-commission and the other was a women's sub-commission. Would your organization agree with this recommendation?
Ms. Lavallée: They have a valid point, but I am not sure if sub-commissions would be the answer. I believe there should be perhaps separate forums for youth and women.
It is very difficult for youth to be in the room. I have learned this over the years in dealing with Aboriginal youth. When they are in a room with adults, they tend to be overwhelmed and they do not talk too much. They need a forum where they can talk openly, as young people do.
Senator Campbell: I think that there would be a sub-commission for youth and a similar commission for women to discuss these issues.
Ms. Lavallée: I would definitely agree to that. I do not think you will get women or youth to fully open up in a mixed environment. Some of the issues that are being talked about are just too sensitive.
Senator Campbell: Second, there is a recurring theme with witnesses that they have not been allowed or asked to participate or there is a lack of communication from the TRC. So many organizations want to be involved in this because it is so encompassing that I wonder if there should not be a reverse onus on the organizations to approach the TRC to be included.
You are not the first witness that said we want to be involved but no one has asked us. When I listen to the TRC, they are so busy. There is so much going on and they see this looming time, which may or may not be realistic. Therefore, I wonder if there should not be a reverse onus.
If I wanted to be involved in the TRC, I would make sure that I got involved. I would be going to them and putting forward my case. Does that make sense or am I dreaming in technicolour?
Ms. Lavallée: No, you are not dreaming in technicolour. My comments about communication being weak were not a criticism of the TRC. The fact is that, due to the problems in getting started, they are now playing catch-up. They inform us of major functions they are having, but I am hearing complaints that the word is not getting down to the survivors themselves.
However, as the TRC begins to roll out its mandate, hopefully communications will improve for the survivors. Again, the onus is on leadership, even at the national level. I have to ensure that I pass on any information that I get to my provincial affiliates.
It is a two-way street between the Aboriginal organizations and the TRC. You are right that there are hundreds of Aboriginal organizations across Canada, and everyone has a stake in this.
The Chair: Historically, CAP represented the Metis people, and apparently the Metis people have fallen through the cracks in this residential schools process. Have you any comment?
Clément Chartier of the Metis National Council spoke to me about this. The previous government and the present government both dealt with it in the same way. A lot of Metis children were in Indian residential schools, and they have not been treated the same as First Nations people.
Ms. Lavallée: That is why I said in my brief that they have to be included. They did attend residential schools and they suffered the same abuse, and they are suffering today the intergenerational affects of abuse and violence. It is not fair to leave anyone out.
Senator Dallaire: Thank you for telling us that you have served in the forces. Are you aware that there are now 18 Aboriginal officer cadets at the Royal Military College?
Ms. Lavallée: Yes, I am.
Senator Dallaire: A substantial number of them are women. That brings me to the reconciliation side of truth and reconciliation.
Internationally, much of the reconciliation is being built on empowerment of women first and on education second in order to enable youth to handle the future.
In the process of the TRC, do you think that those two elements are given the proper priority? In your societies women are far from being fully empowered in a number of areas.
Ms. Lavallée: Historically our societies were matrilineal. Women were the decision makers. You destroy a nation or a community by taking away its backbone, which is the women and children. Special attention must be paid to women in order for them to take their rightful place in society. The bottom line is that without women and children we cease to exist.
I do not think enough emphasis has been placed on the issue of youth and women. We have taken a generic approach, and that does not work. Women, youth and men have different issues, and they deal with them differently, so there must be different ways of facilitating each.
Senator Dallaire: Am I putting words in your mouth to say that your assessment of the TRC is that empowerment of women and education was not emphasized sufficiently to bring about truth and reconciliation?
Ms. Lavallée: You are a little bit. The commission has been under way for less than a year. They have a huge burden and it will take at least a year for them to get their feet beneath them. I was invited to their first community gathering, which was held in Winnipeg. I sent a member of our organization who attended a residential school because I thought it was more appropriate that they be there than myself.
As they get momentum and hear from various groups, from women and from youth, I think that, in addition to their seven mandated gatherings, they will have to squeeze in an additional meeting for women and one for youth.
Senator Dallaire: You made a strong statement about the psychological effects of the residential school experience on individuals, families and subsequent generations. This whole exercise has a very limited time frame.
Should consideration be given to spending a longer time at this in order to assist those who have been significantly psychologically affected by the experience?
Ms. Lavallée: Dates can be moved. The onus is on the TRC, in conjunction with Aboriginal organizations, to ask for an extension if they believe that the work is not completed. If that is not possible, I hope that when the work is concluded measures will be in place to assist people in dealing with the residual effects of this healing journey, because once those wounds are opened, it will be hard to close them. This is no different than PTSD; it never goes away.
Senator Dallaire: Without putting words in your mouth, you see a requirement for a longer-term commitment to assist the people who are grappling with the traumas they have experienced in the form of psychological, therapeutic and community support. There has to be a structure in place to continue this exercise.
Ms. Lavallée: You have that support in place: It is called the Aboriginal Healing Foundation. They have an endowment. I do not see why they cannot take the principal of their endowment, invest it, live off the interest and continue with the good work they have been doing in the communities. This is exactly what happened with the monies given to the Japanese community when the Government of Canada settled with them. I believe they took $10 million at the time, but do not quote me. They invested it and are able to fund their organization to fight racism across Canada from the interest earned on the investment.
I understand that the Aboriginal Healing Foundation was given an endowment. Let them invest that money and use the interest to be self-sustaining.
Senator Dallaire: Are you referring to the approximate $100 million from a couple of years ago?
Ms. Lavallée: They still have funds. Let them take the principal, invest it and live off the interest to continue the work they are doing. They might have to scale back some community projects, but there is nothing wrong with that. Everyone these days has to scale back and live within their means. That is our reality in Canada and the world during a recession. This would not require any further government input or funding from the Government of Canada. They have their funding; let them invest the principal, live off the interest to continue their work.
Senator Raine: Could you clarify for some of the newer senators how the Council of Aboriginal Peoples is structured? What is its mandate? What is its vision statement? After your answer, I would like to ask a few questions about how this relates to it.
Ms. Lavallée: The CAP has provincial and territorial organizations across Canada. From each province, there is a chief, president, or leader. They make up the governing body of the Congress of Aboriginal Peoples. Each year we are mandated to have an annual general assembly to which each province sends 16 delegates. The delegation must include a youth and an elder, and they set the mandate for the organization for the year. They are the body that elects us. It is similar to the Liberal, the Conservative or the NDP governing bodies.
The mission of CAP is to advocate on behalf of off-reserve people to ensure that they have full access and equity to programs and services, in particular treaty rights for those who are treaty people, like I am, and that those who identify as Metis have full recognition and access to their rights and benefits.
Senator Raine: Does each of your provincial organizations have a way of contacting the off-reserve Aboriginals that they represent?
Ms. Lavallée: For example, in my home province of New Brunswick, we have seven zones. Each zone has a director, chief or leader. They make up the governing body of that organization. They also have a youth representative and an elder. Within their area of responsibility, they have communities, and each community has a leader. The information goes right down and comes right back. They have ways to get the information out.
Most of our organizations have quarterly newspapers. The congress sends its quarterly newspaper to each senator, member of Parliament and premier. We have an extensive mailing list. We have the capabilities to get the message out.
Senator Raine: Do you operate any programs at the national level or is it a coordinating body only?
Ms. Lavallée: We do not operate any programs at the national level. Our work at the national level is purely research and advocacy. The only program we have is our assets program for employment and training, which allows us to assist our PTOs and their people to achieve employment, attend community college and do some research if required. Other than that, all programs and services are delivered at the community level.
Senator Raine: How is your organization funded? Is it funded top down or bottom up? Is there a membership fee?
Ms. Lavallée: No. Our organization has to apply to the federal government under the Office of the Federal Interlocutor. We have basic organizational capacity funding. We are required to fill out the form, just like anybody else, and submit it. It goes through peer review and flows back down. Each organization within the Congress of Aboriginal Peoples is responsible for its own. They have to meet the same standards. Each year we are audited by an outside audit firm. The results of the audit are presented to each of our funding agencies. The provincial organizations have to go through the same process.
Senator Raine: Your core funding comes from the federal government. Does the core funding for the provincial organizations come from the federal government?
Ms. Lavallée: They have to go through the same process as the national organization. They have to apply and meet the standards set out by Treasury Board guidelines and the policy of the federal government under the Office of the Federal Interlocutor.
Senator Raine: What is your total budget?
Ms. Lavallée: My funding from the OFI for the year is $1 million for basic organizational capacity. We have a bilateral accord with the federal government that is $847,000.
Senator Raine: Can you explain the bilateral accord?
Ms. Lavallée: The bilateral accord allows us to interact with the various federal departments on issues that affect Aboriginal peoples, such as health. Currently, our four priority areas are education, economic development, health and governance — the four capacities, based on the federal framework agreement, looking at the whole-of-government approach.
Senator Lovelace Nicholas: Do you hold healing sessions for the survivors?
Ms. Lavallée: No, we are not capable of doing that. That occurs at the local community levels.
Senator Lovelace Nicholas: Do you know anything about how it is put on at the local level?
Ms. Lavallée: Various organizations or communities have different ways of doing it, depending on the area of Canada. We all have our unique traditions and cultures.
In P.E.I., they are always holding something, whether it is a powwow, youth gathering or elders gathering. At the national level, we try to bring our elders together once a year so they can exchange ideas and mentor the youth, because we also bring our youth together once a year prior to our assembly. We try to build into all of our programs the ability for youth to attend everything — and the elders, if possible. There is a component there for them to input, because it is their future we will be looking after.
Each group has a different way of doing their own healing. Some of our people participate in sweats. I have been fortunate in New Brunswick to attend different things with Imelda Perley and David Perly and his wife.
Senator Lovelace Nicholas: I know them well.
Ms. Lavallée: I have been fortunate to be involved in some of their stuff.
Senator Lovelace Nicholas: Are you saying that they have a leader of the truth and reconciliation process in each community?
Ms. Lavallée: No.
Senator Lovelace Nicholas: How do these people get to these healing ceremonies?
Ms. Lavallée: Each community has a community leader that can pass on any information of any meetings. Unfortunately, it is up to community to raise funds for people to attend some of these functions. From what I understand, there is no funding for that.
Senator Lovelace Nicholas: Have the members expressed feedback to you — satisfaction or dissatisfaction? What were their concerns?
Ms. Lavallée: Some of the feedback was the inability to afford to attend some of the functions, which is unfortunate because we are talking, in some cases, some of the poorest of the poor. They felt they were being ignored, that they were not getting a fair chance to participate.
Not being a full partner in the TRC when it was first conceived, all we can do is pass on contact information to these people and have them contact the TRC directly. I hope that the TRC will recognize that need and will move some of these forums close to some of these people.
Senator Lovelace Nicholas: I agree with you.
Senator Campbell: I do not want this to be seen as a criticism of your organization in any way. I am just trying to get my head around this. There is $1 million and then there is $870,000, so it is $1.8 million — there is $1 million total.
Ms. Lavallée: That is our core funding to run the head office for a full year.
Senator Campbell: That is it to CAP.
Ms. Lavallée: Yes.
Senator Campbell: How many members do you have that belong to CAP?
Ms. Lavallée: CAP does not represent the people. There is no possible way we can because of the difference from Mi'kmaq Maliseet right across Canada.
We represent the provincial organization. They represent the members, and part of their requirement to maintain good standing with the congress each year is they have to send in verifiable numbers. It is a requirement of the Office of the Federal Interlocutor and the minister.
Senator Campbell: I am from British Columbia. One of the comments I hear is that CAP represents First Nations of the East, Ontario and east, and not of the West. In British Columbia, is there a British Columbia CAP organization?
Ms. Lavallée: That is the United Native Nations and Lillian George is the president.
Senator Campbell: Please tell us where she is from.
Ms. Lavallée: I believe she is out of Prince George, but their main office is located in Vancouver and they have been an affiliate of the congress since the early 1970s.
Senator Campbell: How many members do they have?
Ms. Lavallée: I honestly could not tell you, Senator Campbell. You would have to check with President George.
Senator Campbell: I can do that. It is better for me now that I know it is United Native Nations. I am looking for CAP and it is not CAP. It could be a different name in every province.
Ms. Lavallée: In New Brunswick, it is the New Brunswick Aboriginal Peoples Council; in Nova Scotia, it is the Native Council of Nova Scotia. We have been in existence since 1972.
Senator Campbell: I am aware of that. I knew you had provincial organizations, but I could not figure it out because of the different names.
You said that you are audited every year.
Ms. Lavallée: Yes, sir.
Senator Campbell: How have the audits been for the last five years?
Ms. Lavallée: Rotten.
Senator Campbell: That is honest.
Ms. Lavallée: I do not lie about stuff like that. If you go to our website, it is posted there for all to see.
Senator Campbell: What steps are being taken? Obviously, you do not want it to be rotten forever. What steps are being taken to ensure, for instance, that the audit this year comes in clean?
Ms. Lavallée: The audit this year will come in clean. One step that is being taken is we now have a full-time certified general accountant on staff.
Senator Campbell: That always helps.
Ms. Lavallée: It definitely does. We also will have a human resources person who will be responsible for the hiring and the general administration of the staff.
Senator Campbell: First Nations have a number of ways of expressing themselves and a number of organizations that represent them. There are hundreds of different organizations. This was not meant to put you on the spot and I appreciate your honesty and candour.
Ms. Lavallée: You are welcome, senator.
The Chair: Thank you, Ms. Lavallée. We appreciate your presence here tonight — your presentation and your candour. I do not believe there are any other questions.
Senator Dallaire: I would like to pursue the question of the impact of the residential schools on the communities, the societies and the individuals. In reviewing my documentation, the Aboriginal Healing Foundation is that continuum of the programs I was speaking of earlier, with the 134 funded projects doing different things. Then you have the IRS program, which is emotional health and wellness support services.
My point is when we have people who have been affected by psychological trauma; we recognize this is a long-term exercise to permit them to get the therapy, support and the priority of support they need to resolve that trauma. Both of these programs seem to be funded for finite period of times and they are using up the funds during those time frames.
Why has there not been, or should there be, consideration by the TRC to establish funding for deliberate long-term support to the individuals who have been traumatized, rather than continuously every two years or three years throwing more money at it and then you have to argue to start it up again.
Ms. Lavallée: First, I do not think the TRC is mandated to do that. I do not think they have the power or the ability to do that. That is something that I believe would be able to occur only through a policy change within the federal government, in particular through Health Canada.
That is why I am saying you already have an established body that has been doing quite good work across the country. They already have funding in place. As I said, you do not have to reinvent the wheel. It would not require any federal funding. They would have to invest the principal and live on the interest. Community projects will have to be scaled back, but we all have had to make cuts in our lives.
Senator Dallaire: We are back to where we were, and I am having a problem with that. I want to emphasize that if we are talking about reconciliation, we are talking longer term than 2014, and surely, the commission should have the responsibility of giving us long-term policy alternatives.
Ms. Lavallée: That would come at the community level as well. Most on-reserve communities do get some health care. That would have to be a priority at that community level. To stretch our dollar nowadays, many of us have to find partners. There is nothing wrong with that, and that is what we try to do.
Those of us who live off-reserve do not have access to those funds, so for the most part we are at the mercy of the provincial health care system, which in my opinion, is not adequate to deal with those who live off-reserve.
Senator Dallaire: Thank you for hitting the button I was looking for.
The Chair: Thank you, Ms. Lavallée, and thank you, senators.
(The committee continued in camera.)