Journals of the Senate
52 Elizabeth II, A.D. 2003, Canada
Journals of the Senate
2nd Session, 37th Parliament
Issue 96
Thursday, November 6, 2003
1:30 p.m.
The Honourable Daniel Hays, Speaker
The Members convened were:
The Honourable Senators
Andreychuk, Angus, Bacon, Baker, Banks, Beaudoin, Biron, Bryden, Buchanan, Callbeck, Carstairs, Chalifoux, Chaput, Christensen, Cochrane, Comeau, Cools, Corbin, Cordy, Day, De Bané, Doody, Downe, Fairbairn, Finnerty, Forrestall, Fraser, Furey, Gauthier, Gill, Grafstein, Graham, Gustafson, Harb, Hays, Hervieux-Payette, Hubley, Jaffer, Johnson, Joyal, Kelleher, Kenny, Keon, Kinsella, Kroft, Lapointe, Lavigne, Lawson, Léger, Losier-Cool, Lynch-Staunton, Maheu, Merchant, Milne, Moore, Morin, Nolin, Oliver, Pearson, Pépin, Phalen, Pitfield, Plamondon, Poulin (Charette), Poy, Prud'homme, Ringuette, Rivest, Robertson, Robichaud, Roche, Rompkey, Sibbeston, Smith, Sparrow, Spivak, St. Germain, Stollery, Stratton, Tkachuk, Watt, Wiebe
The Members in attendance to business were:
The Honourable Senators
Andreychuk, Angus, Bacon, Baker, Banks, Beaudoin, Biron, Bryden, Buchanan, Callbeck, Carstairs, Chalifoux, Chaput, Christensen, Cochrane, Comeau, Cools, Corbin, Cordy, Day, De Bané, Doody, Downe, Fairbairn, Finnerty, *Fitzpatrick, Forrestall, Fraser, Furey, Gauthier, Gill, Grafstein, Graham, Gustafson, Harb, Hays, Hervieux-Payette, Hubley, Jaffer, Johnson, Joyal, Kelleher, Kenny, Keon, Kinsella, *Kirby, Kroft, Lapointe, Lavigne, Lawson, *LeBreton, Léger, Losier-Cool, Lynch-Staunton, Maheu, Merchant, Milne, Moore, Morin, Nolin, Oliver, Pearson, Pépin, Phalen, Pitfield, Plamondon, Poulin (Charette), Poy, Prud'homme, Ringuette, Rivest, Robertson, Robichaud, Roche, Rompkey, Sibbeston, Smith, Sparrow, Spivak, St. Germain, Stollery, Stratton, Tkachuk, Watt, Wiebe
PRAYERS
SENATORS' STATEMENTS
Some Honourable Senators made statements.
DAILY ROUTINE OF BUSINESS
Tabling of Documents
The Honourable Senator Robichaud, P.C., tabled the following:
Government Response to the Third Report of the Standing Senate Committee on Official Languages on Environmental Scan: Access to Justice in Both Official Languages.—Sessional Paper No. 2/37-796S.
Document entitled: Canadian Position with Respect to Recommendation 193, a Protocol to Convention 155 and Recommendation 194 adopted at the 90th Session of the International Labour Conference held in Geneva, Switzerland in June 2002.—Sessional Paper No. 2/37-797.
Presentation of Reports from Standing or Special Committees
The Honourable Senator Oliver, Chair of the Standing Senate Committee on Agriculture and Forestry, tabled its Sixth Report (Final) entitled: Climate Change: We Are At Risk.—Sessional Paper No. 2/37-798S.
The Honourable Senator Oliver, moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Robertson, that the Report be placed on the Orders of the Day for consideration at the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Furey, Chair of the Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs, tabled its Ninth Report (Regulations pursuant to Section 118 of the Firearms Act). —Sessional Paper No. 2/37-799S.
The Honourable Senator Kroft, Chair of the Standing Senate Committee on Banking, Trade and Commerce, presented its Sixteenth Report (Bill C-48, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act (natural resources)) without amendment.
The Honourable Senator Kroft moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Wiebe, that the Bill be placed on the Orders of the Day for a third reading at the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Hervieux-Payette, P.C., Joint Chair of the Standing Joint Committee for the Scrutiny of Regulations, tabled its Fourth Report (national parks).—Sessional Paper No. 2/37-800S.
The Honourable Senator Stollery, Chair of the Standing Senate Committee on Foreign Affairs tabled its Sixth Report (Interim) entitled: The Rising Dollar: Explanation and Economic Impacts (Volume 2).—Sessional Paper No. 2/ 37-801S.
The Honourable Senator Stollery moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Smith, P.C., that the Report be placed on the Orders of the Day for consideration at the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Comeau presented the following:
THURSDAY, November 6, 2003
The Standing Senate Committee on Fisheries and Oceans has the honour to present its
SEVENTH REPORT
Pursuant to Appendix IV of the Rules of the Senate, your Committee hereby reports on the question of privilege raised by the Honourable Senator Comeau on Tuesday, May 27, 2003.
On Thursday, May 15, 2003, the Canadian Press ran a story dealing with artificial reefs, one topic addressed in a confidential document that your Committee had considered in camera two days earlier. On Friday, May 16, several newspapers picked up this story.
On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, the first day on which the Senate sat following the initial publication of this story, the Chair of your Committee, pursuant to Rule 43, gave written notice of, and subsequently raised in the Senate, a question of privilege relating to this matter. The Speaker ruled that there was a prima facie question of privilege and, pursuant to Appendix IV of the Rules of the Senate, your Committee was charged with examining the matter and reporting thereon to the Senate.
Your Committee subsequently reviewed the matter and has concluded that the premature release of material did not affect the content of its Fifth Report, which was tabled in the Senate on Monday, June 16, 2003. The material to which the media made reference dealt with a subject that had been dropped from the report prior to the disclosure. Where this premature release could, however, have had negative effects was on the collaborative working relationship between members of the Committee. This working relationship is extremely close, having been built up over many years. An incident such as this leak has the potential to decrease this strong sense of trust and teamwork.
Your Committee has also concluded that the rigor of a formal investigation could have significant detrimental effects on the excellent relationships between members of your Committee, their employees, and the staff of your Committee, and would therefore have a negative impact on the Committee's effectiveness. Actions such as hiring an external investigator could compromise even further the cohesion of the Committee. Your Committee is also far from confident that a more in-depth formal investigation would actually succeed in identifying the source of the leak.
Your Committee's general conclusion is that the leak, while highly regrettable, was accidental. It probably arose from a failure to appreciate fully the importance of respecting the confidentiality of matters dealt with in camera and related documents.
Your Committee takes this opportunity to emphasize, to all Senators, Senate staff, and others involved in dealing with confidential documents, the importance of dealing with these in the most cautious manner. It is, in dealing with these materials, always better to err on the side of caution in order to avoid the inadvertent release of information that the Senate is entitled to receive first.
In light of the above, your Committee recommends that no further action be taken in relation to this particular leak.
Respectfully submitted,
GERALD J. COMEAU
Chair
The Honourable Senator Comeau moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Beaudoin, that the Report be placed on the Orders of the Day for consideration at the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Comeau, Chair of the Standing Senate Committee on Fisheries and Oceans tabled its Eighth Report (Interim) entitled: Fish Habitat.—Sessional Paper No. 2/37-802S.
The Honourable Senator Comeau moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Spivak, that the Report be placed on the Orders of the Day for consideration at the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Tabling of Reports from Inter-Parliamentary Delegations
The Honourable Senator Oliver tabled the following:
Report of the Canadian Group of the Inter-Parliamentary Union respecting its participation at the 108th Inter- Parliamentary Conference and related meetings, held in Santiago de Chile, from April 3 to 12, 2003.—Sessional Paper No. 2/37-803.
Presentation of Petitions
The Honourable Senator Gauthier presented petitions:
Of Residents of the Provinces of Ontario and Quebec with respect to declaring Ottawa officially bilingual.
ORDERS OF THE DAY
GOVERNMENT BUSINESS
Bills
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Carstairs, P.C., seconded by the Honourable Senator Robichaud, P.C.:
That, with respect to the House of Commons Message to the Senate dated September 29, 2003 regarding Bill C-10B:
(i) the Senate do not insist on its amendment numbered 2;
(ii) the Senate do not insist on its modified version of amendment numbered 3 to which the House of Commons disagreed;
(iii) the Senate do not insist on its modified version of amendment numbered 4, but it do concur in the amendment made by the House of Commons to amendment numbered 4; and
That a Message be sent to the House of Commons to acquaint that House accordingly,
And on the motion of the Honourable Senator Watt, seconded by the Honourable Senator Adams, that the motion, together with the message from the House of Commons dated September 29, 2003, regarding Bill C-10B, An Act to amend the Criminal Code (cruelty to animals), be referred to the Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs for consideration and report.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted on the following vote:
YEAS
The Honourable Senators
Andreychuk, Bacon, Baker, Beaudoin, Biron, Bryden, Chalifoux, Chaput, Christensen, Cools, Corbin, Cordy, Doody, Forrestall, Furey, Gill, Hervieux-Payette, Johnson, Joyal, Keon, Kinsella, Lapointe, Lawson, Lynch-Staunton, Maheu, Moore, Nolin, Oliver, Pearson, Pépin, Phalen, Pitfield, Prud'homme, Rivest, Robertson, Sibbeston, Sparrow, Spivak, Stratton, Watt—40
NAYS
The Honourable Senators
Callbeck, Carstairs, Day, De Bané, Downe, Fairbairn, Fraser, Graham, Harb, Hubley, Jaffer, Léger, Losier-Cool, Merchant, Milne, Morin, Poy, Ringuette, Robichaud, Roche, Rompkey, Smith, Wiebe—23
ABSTENTIONS
The Honourable Senators
Gauthier—1
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Carstairs, P.C., seconded by the Honourable Senator Robichaud, P.C., for the third reading of Bill C-34, An Act to amend the Parliament of Canada Act (Ethics Commissioner and Senate Ethics Officer) and other Acts in consequence.
After debate,
In amendment, the Honourable Senator Bryden moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Sparrow, that Bill C- 34 be not now read the third time but that it be amended,
(a) in clause 2,
(i) on page 1, by replacing lines 8 to 27 with the following:
"20.1 The Senate shall, by resolution and with the consent of the leaders of all recognized parties in the Senate, appoint a Senate Ethics Counsellor.''
(ii) on page 2, by deleting lines 1 to 49,
(iii) on page 3, by deleting lines 1 to 11.
Debate.
DEFERRED VOTE
At 5:30 p.m., and pursuant to Rule 67, the Senate proceeded to the taking of the deferred standing vote on the motion in amendment of the Honourable Senator Nolin to the motion of the Honourable Senator Smith, P.C., seconded by the Honourable Senator Léger, for the second reading of Bill C-49, An Act respecting the effective date of the representation order of 2003.
The question was put on the motion in amendment of the Honourable Senator Nolin, seconded by the Honourable Senator Stratton, that Bill C-49 be not now read the second time but that the subject-matter thereof be referred to the Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs; and
That the Order to resume debate on the motion for the second reading of the Bill remain on the Order Paper.
The motion in amendment was negatived on the following vote:
YEAS
The Honourable Senators
Andreychuk, Beaudoin, Cochrane, Doody, Forrestall, Johnson, Keon, Kinsella, Lynch-Staunton, Nolin, Prud'homme, Rivest, Robertson, Stratton—14
NAYS
The Honourable Senators
Bacon, Banks, Biron, Bryden, Callbeck, Carstairs, Chalifoux, Chaput, Christensen, Cools, Corbin, Cordy, Day, De Bané, Downe, Fairbairn, Finnerty, Fraser, Furey, Gauthier, Gill, Grafstein, Graham, Harb, Hubley, Jaffer, Joyal, Kenny, Kroft, Lapointe, Léger, Losier-Cool, Merchant, Milne, Moore, Morin, Pearson, Pépin, Phalen, Plamondon, Poulin, Poy, Ringuette, Robichaud, Roche, Rompkey, Sibbeston, Smith, Sparrow, Stollery, Watt, Wiebe—52ABSTENTIONS
The Honourable Senators
Nil\Aucun
MESSAGES FROM THE HOUSE OF COMMONS
A Message was brought from the House of Commons to return Bill S-21, An Act to amalgamate the Canadian Association of Insurance and Financial Advisors and The Canadian Association of Financial Planners under the name The Financial Advisors Association of Canada,
And to acquaint the Senate that the Commons have passed this Bill, without amendment.
Bills
The Senate resumed debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Carstairs, P.C., seconded by the Honourable Senator Robichaud, P.C., for the third reading of Bill C-34, An Act to amend the Parliament of Canada Act (Ethics Commissioner and Senate Ethics Officer) and other Acts in consequence
And on the motion in amendment of the Honourable Senator Bryden, seconded by the Honourable Senator Sparrow, that Bill C-34 be not now read the third time but that it be amended,
(a) in clause 2,
(i) on page 1, by replacing lines 8 to 27 with the following:
"20.1 The Senate shall, by resolution and with the consent of the leaders of all recognized parties in the Senate, appoint a Senate Ethics Counsellor.''
(ii) on page 2, by deleting lines 1 to 49,
(iii) on page 3, by deleting lines 1 to 11.
Debate.
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Pursuant to Rule 13(1), the Speaker left the Chair to resume the same at 8:00 p.m.
The sitting resumed.
Bills
The Senate resumed debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Carstairs, P.C., seconded by the Honourable Senator Robichaud, P.C., for the third reading of Bill C-34, An Act to amend the Parliament of Canada Act (Ethics Commissioner and Senate Ethics Officer) and other Acts in consequence
And on the motion in amendment of the Honourable Senator Bryden, seconded by the Honourable Senator Sparrow, that Bill C-34 be not now read the third time but that it be amended,
(a) in clause 2,
(i) on page 1, by replacing lines 8 to 27 with the following:
"20.1 The Senate shall, by resolution and with the consent of the leaders of all recognized parties in the Senate, appoint a Senate Ethics Counsellor.''
(ii) on page 2, by deleting lines 1 to 49,
(iii) on page 3, by deleting lines 1 to 11.
After debate,
The question was put on the motion in amendment.
With leave of the Senate, a standing vote was deferred until 12:30 p.m. tomorrow, with the bells to sound at twelve noon for thirty minutes.
Third reading of Bill C-37, An Act to amend the Canadian Forces Superannuation Act and to make consequential amendments to other Acts.
The Honourable Senator Wiebe moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Banks, that the Bill be read the third time.
After debate,
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Bill was then read the third time and passed.
Ordered, That a Message be sent to the House of Commons to acquaint that House that the Senate have passed this Bill, without amendment.
Third reading of Bill C-50, An Act to amend the statute law in respect of benefits for veterans and the children of deceased veterans.
The Honourable Senator Cordy moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Chalifoux, that the Bill be read the third time.
After debate,
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Bill was then read the third time and passed.
Ordered, That a Message be sent to the House of Commons to acquaint that House that the Senate have passed this Bill, without amendment.
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Smith, P.C., seconded by the Honourable Senator Léger, for the second reading of Bill C-49, An Act respecting the effective date of the representation order of 2003.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Rivest moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Keon, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was negatived on the following vote:
YEAS
The Honourable Senators
Forrestall, Johnson, Keon, Kinsella, Lynch-Staunton, Rivest, Robertson, Spivak, Stratton—9
NAYS
The Honourable Senators
Bacon, Banks, Biron, Callbeck, Carstairs, Chalifoux, Chaput, Christensen, Corbin, Cordy, Day, Downe, Fairbairn, Fraser, Furey, Gill, Grafstein, Graham, Hubley, Jaffer, Joyal, Kenny, Kroft, Léger, Losier-Cool, Maheu, Milne, Moore, Morin, Pépin, Phalen, Poy, Ringuette, Robichaud, Roche, Rompkey, Sibbeston, Smith, Sparrow, Stollery, Watt, Wiebe—42
ABSTENTIONS
The Honourable Senators
Cools, Prud'homme—2
The Senate resumed debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Smith, P.C., seconded by the Honourable Senator Léger, for the second reading of Bill C-49, An Act respecting the effective date of the representation order of 2003.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Robertson moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Forrestall, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted on division.
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Morin, seconded by the Honourable Senator Gauthier, for the second reading of Bill C-13, An Act respecting assisted human reproduction and related research.
After debate.
The Honourable Senator Kinsella moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Stratton, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Carstairs, P.C., seconded by the Honourable Senator Robichaud, P.C., for the second reading of Bill C-17, An Act to amend certain Acts of Canada, and to enact measures for implementing the Biological and Toxin Weapons Convention, in order to enhance public safety.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Forrestall moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Stratton, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
Order No. 8 was called and postponed until the next sitting.
Reports of Committees
Order No. 1 was called and postponed until the next sitting.
OTHER BUSINESS
Senate Public Bills
Orders No. 1 to 9 were called and postponed until the next sitting.
Commons Public Bills
Orders No. 1 and 2 were called and postponed until the next sitting.
Reports of Committees
Order No. 1 was called and postponed until the next sitting.
Resuming debate on the consideration of the Seventh Report of the Standing Senate Committee on Human Rights (fact-finding mission), tabled in the Senate on November 4, 2003.
Debate.
At 12:00 o'clock midnight, pursuant to Rule 6(1), the Senate adjourned until tomorrow, Friday, November 7, 2003, at 9:00 a.m.
REPORTS DEPOSITED WITH THE CLERK OF THE SENATE PURSUANT TO RULE 28(2):
Report of the Canadian International Trade Tribunal entitled "Request for Tariff Relief by Trybal Sportswear Inc. Regarding Certain Woven Fabrics of Polyester/Rayon/Elastomeric Monofilament'', dated October 20, 2003, pursuant to the Canada-United States Free Trade Agreement Implementation Act, S. C. 1988, c. 65, s. 54..—Sessional Paper No. 2/37-790.
Report of the Financial Transactions and Reports Analysis Centre of Canada for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Proceeds of Crime (Money Laundering) and Terrorist Financing Act), S.C. 2000, c. 17, sbs. 71(1).—Sessional Paper No. 2/37-791.
Report of the Registrar of the Canadian Firearms Registry for the year 2002, pursuant to the Firearms Act, S.C. 1995, c. 39, sbs. 93(2).—Sessional Paper No. 2/37-792.
Report on the use of electronic surveillance for the year 2002, pursuant to the Criminal Code, R.S.C. 1985, c. C-46, sbs. 195(4). —Sessional Paper No. 2/37-793.
Report of the review of the provisions and operations of the National Defence Act, including the comments of the Minister of National Defence on the First Independent Review of Bill C-25, pursuant to the National Defence Act, R.S.C. 1985, c. 35, s. 96. —Sessional Paper No. 2/37-794.
Documents entitled: "Banff Community Plan'', "Field Community Plan, Yoho National Park, July 1999'', "Jasper Community Land Use Plan, Jasper National Park of Canada, 2001'', "Lake Louise, Banff National Park of Canada, Community Plan, June 2001'', "Wasagaming Community Plan'', "Waterton Lakes National Park, 2000 Waterton Community Plan'', "Waskesiu Community Plan'' and "Order Amending Schedule 4 to the Canada National Parks Act'', pursuant to the Canada National Parks Act, S.C. 2000, c. 32, sbs. 34(1). —Sessional Paper No. 2/37-795.
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Changes in Membership of Committees Pursuant to Rule 85(4)
Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs
The name of the Honourable Senator Sibbeston substituted for that of the Honourable Senator Jaffer (November 5).
The name of the Honourable Senator Jaffer substituted for that of the Honourable Senator Sibbeston (November 6).
Standing Senate Committee on Official Languages
The name of the Honourable Senator Kinsella substituted for that of the Honourable Senator Comeau (November 5).