THE STANDING SENATE COMMITTEE ON INDIGENOUS PEOPLES
EVIDENCE
OTTAWA, Wednesday, November 20, 2024
The Standing Senate Committee on Indigenous Peoples met with videoconference this day at 6:45 p.m. [ET] to study the subject matter of Bill S-268, An Act to amend the Criminal Code and the Indian Act.
Senator Brian Francis (Chair) in the chair.
[English]
The Chair: Honourable senators, before we begin, I would like to ask all senators and other in-person participants to consult the cards on the table for guidelines to prevent audio feedback incidents. Please make sure to keep your earpiece away from all microphones at all times. When you are not using your earpiece, place it face down on the sticker placed on the table for this purpose. Thank you all for your cooperation.
I would like to begin by acknowledging that the land on which we gather is the traditional, ancestral and unceded territory of the Anishinaabe Algonquin Nation and is now home to many other First Nations, Métis and Inuit peoples from across Turtle Island. I am Mi’kmaw Senator Brian Francis from Epekwitk, also known as Prince Edward Island, and I am the Chair of the Standing Senate Committee on Indigenous Peoples.
I will now ask committee members in attendance to introduce themselves by stating their name and province or territory.
Senator Arnot: I’m David Arnot. I’m a senator from Saskatchewan, and I live in Saskatoon, which is in the heart of Treaty 6 territory.
Senator McNair: Good evening and welcome. I’m John McNair. I’m from the province of New Brunswick.
Senator Hartling: Good evening. I’m Nancy Hartling, a senator from New Brunswick on the unceded territory of the Mi’kmaw people.
Senator Tannas: Scott Tannas from Alberta.
Senator Prosper: Paul Prosper, Nova Scotia, Mi’kma’ki territory.
Senator Greenwood: Margo Greenwood, British Columbia, but originally from the best of Treaty 6 territory in Alberta. Welcome.
The Chair: Thank you, everyone. Today, we will continue our study of the subject matter of Senate public Bill S-268, An Act to amend the Criminal Code and the Indian Act to authorize First Nations governing bodies and those designated by them to conduct, manage and regulate lottery schemes on-reserve.
I would now like to introduce our witnesses for today: From the Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations, we welcome Chief Bobby Cameron, accompanied by John C. Hill, Legal Counsel. From the Tsuut’ina Nation, we welcome Chief Roy Whitney, accompanied by Terry Braun, General Counsel. Thank you all for joining us today.
The witnesses will provide opening remarks of approximately five minutes, which will be followed by a question-and-answer session with the senators. I will now invite Chief Cameron to give his opening remarks.
Bobby Cameron, Chief, Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations: [Indigenous language spoken]
We want to give thanks to our Creator for a beautiful day today. We thank our knowledge keepers for the protocols, the pipes and holding the prayers.
Honourable Senate committee, we give thanks for this opportunity to speak to you and to give you our comments and our vision moving forward together in this country of Canada, from our perspective.
My name is Bobby Cameron. I come from the Witchekan Lake First Nation in Treaty 6 territory in Saskatchewan. It is an honour and a privilege to be part of this important discussion and this important historic moment in Canada.
Senators and Senate committee — each and every one of you — we give thanks to Brian Francis, David Arnot, Mary Coyle, Yonah Martin, Paul Prosper, Judy White, Margo Greenwood, John McNair, Karen Sorensen, Nancy Hartling, Donald Plett and Scott Tannas, who we want to acknowledge for your support the last few years in introducing this very important bill. It’s a bill that we believe and know is going to enhance and improve the lives of First Nations people, both on-reserve and off-reserve. It’s a bill that will benefit all First Nations throughout this country of Canada.
We’ve been in the gaming business for 31 years in our region. We’re proud to say that in 1993, the White Bear First Nation was named the first First Nation in Canada to operate and own a casino on-reserve. Since the Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations, or FSIN, and the Province of Saskatchewan entered into the Gaming Framework Agreement to develop and create four casinos on First Nations land for First Nations people, created by First Nations people, we now have what we call a treaty right to livelihood — a treaty-based economy.
In the 1800s, our chiefs of the day ensured that we would always uphold, implement and protect our inherent and treaty rights, and this is one of them. It’s a very sacred historic document that we’ve been working toward.
To do this, senators, your name, your family name, your ancestors and all those unborn who are coming into your family name are going to say, “My grandma or my grandpa was part of something very significant for the First Nations people in Canada. My grandpa was there.” In the spirit of economic reconciliation in coordination and alignment with the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, or UNDRIP, this is what we’re doing.
Bill S-268, as we said earlier, is very historic. To do this is not just giving First Nations revenue for the sake of giving revenue. When we spend our monies every day, every month, every year in the towns and cities of Canada — I’ll use our region, for example: We spend $100 million to $200 million in the towns and cities of Saskatchewan. Annually, it means $1 billion to $2 billion a year in the Province of Saskatchewan. The economy of Saskatchewan and the economy of Canada will benefit with this bill. It just means that we’re in control of our own destiny. We assert true jurisdiction in the area of gaming.
By far, the Saskatchewan Indian Gaming Authority, or SIGA, has been the leading company for First Nations gaming. We’re proud of that fact. To date, we’ve generated $1.6 billion since its inception. From that $1.6 billion, the Province of Saskatchewan has been the beneficiary to the tune of $400 million from First Nations business on First Nations land for First Nations people.
We look at it as a tool for creating more housing on-reserve and investing in elders and youth projects. At a time where economic reconciliation is at the forefront, this is your chance, senators, to really be part of something significant and positive. We’ve been in the gaming business for many years, friends and relatives. This is nothing new to us. We speak with passion and knowledge and from the heart. We do this not for us. We do this for our children, our grandchildren and those unborn. We do this to provide a good foundation. We do this to give our children a better life than we ever had and to give our children and our grandchildren more opportunities to succeed in life than we ever had. Let me tell you that being a First Nation growing up in Saskatchewan and other places has been a challenge.
Senate committee, again, thank you for giving us this opportunity. We’ve done the homework, we’ve done the research, and now we’re here to secure your support moving forward on this.
Again, I want to thank one of our chiefs, Chief Roy Whitney, for co-sponsoring and co-introducing this important Bill S-268 as we move along; our chair, Brian Francis, and all of you; and our legal team, John Hill, Terry Braun and many others, who have been anticipating and waiting for this to come to fruition. Again, to each and every one of you, economic reconciliation in alignment with UNDRIP is a very big piece moving forward with this bill and many other bills to come.
We ask each and every one of you to dig deep when you’re lying in bed tonight and think about the future from your heart and from your mind. We honestly believe our God, our Creator, will give you that vision to make the right decision, and that is supporting Bill S-268. Meegwetch.
The Chair: Thank you, Chief Cameron, for your opening remarks.
I will now invite Chief Whitney to give his opening remarks.
Roy Whitney, Chief, Tsuut’ina Nation: Honourable senators, thank you for the opportunity to be present here tonight in this very important session that’s going to effect positive change in our communities.
My name is Chief Roy Whitney, and I’m the Head Chief of the Tsuut’ina Nation. I come from the Onespot clan within my community. We are part of the Dene people. Our linguistic group is the largest in North America. We come from Alaska, Yukon, the Northwest Territories and Manitoba through B.C. and down into the United States, with the Navajo First Nation and the Apache First Nation. Our reserve borders the city of Calgary to the south, to the west, to the east and to the north. Our traditional land goes from the far north of what we now know as Canada and as part of the United States.
We entered into treaty with the British Crown in 1877 along with the other First Nations within Treaty 7. This is our treaty, and it was a peace treaty, a friendship treaty, that allowed us to still be able to provide for ourselves. It was intended so that the treaty would give us that ability to be able to mobilize our strength in various areas. One of them is economic development. One of them is the growth of our communities and our people, investing back in ourselves.
The Tsuut’ina are a strong, independent people, with beliefs embodied in our emblem. If you ever notice our emblem, it has the circle representing the continuity of life, the beaver pelt representing us as beaver people and the peace pipe and the broken arrow representing no more war and peace with all.
Over my 25 years as chief, I have made it a priority to protect our treaty and to maintain our culture, traditions, heritage and language. But I have also made it a priority to develop our economy to provide support and services to our people.
In 2007, we opened the Grey Eagle Casino, and in 2014, we opened the Grey Eagle Hotel and Event Centre. The Grey Eagle Resort and Casino was built entirely with our own First Nation money. It was not monies that were provided through any lottery scheme or economic development scheme. It was First Nations-driven and First Nations-owned and operated.
Gaming has always been a part of our culture, and it has always been a part of our traditions and our customs.
While his language is offensive, Reverend E.F. Wilson, who was an Anglican priest and missionary from England, made these comments in one of his early reports in 1888:
The Sarcees, like most other wild Indians, are inveterate gamblers. They will gamble everything away—ponies, teepees, blankets, leggings, moccasins—till they have nothing left but their breech-clout.
He went on to then describe the games that were played by the Sarcees. We have never given up our treaty right to economic activities, and certainly gaming has been a part of our culture and our traditions for centuries.
We were never consulted when amendments were made to the Criminal Code to allow gambling and gaming, and we were never consulted when the federal government entered into agreements with the provinces across Canada. We have essentially been told that if we want gaming on our lands, we will have to play by the rules and regulations in the Province of Alberta.
There are two key documents in relation to First Nations gaming in the Province of Alberta: the First Nations Gaming Policy and the First Nations Development Fund Grant Agreement. While both the policy and agreement have been signed, Alberta First Nations were not really given a choice — sign or don’t have gaming.
In my opinion, neither the policy nor the agreement are reasonable or fair to host First Nations like Tsuut’ina. Host First Nations like Tsuut’ina must share their earned revenue. We put up the capital, we work the business, we take on the risk, and then we have to give away part of our hard-earned revenue. Host First Nations give 30% of their slot revenue to the Province of Alberta and 10% to non-host First Nations. Effectively, host First Nations give up 40% of the revenue from their hard-earned money generated in their own casinos. To my knowledge, there is no other industry on First Nations lands where a First Nation must give up part of their revenue to the province and part of their revenue to other First Nations.
Since opening, Grey Eagle has given to the Province of Alberta half a billion dollars. Pursuant to the First Nations Development Fund Grant Agreement, this money was supposed to go into a lottery fund. The money now simply goes into the general revenue of the province.
It should also be understood that even the money that does come to a host First Nation is still controlled by the province. Money that is distributed to host First Nation charities can only be used as set out in the Brown Book. Money that is distributed as the First Nations Development Fund must be applied for.
From the revenue that we haven’t given to the province, we have invested it in our community. These percentages vary year by year, but, generally speaking, 14% goes to health and social development, 27% goes to fire and policing, 18% goes to housing and 41% goes to our education program.
We support Bill S-268. This bill will allow First Nations to have the jurisdiction to regulate, conduct and manage gaming on their lands — jurisdiction that we have never given up. Further, Bill S-268 recognizes the rights of Indigenous peoples to determine their economic development and prosperity. We understand that gaming activities must be regulated. We understand that there must be integrity and transparency, there must be responsible gaming practices and there must be strict adherence to anti-money laundering laws.
We are working with other gaming First Nations to develop a memorandum of understanding, or MOU, to set out guiding principles. We understand that there must be a regulatory framework established to give comfort to the public that casinos will be held to the highest standards of fairness, integrity and transparency and in compliance with generally accepted standards in the gaming industry.
To close, the enactment of Bill S-268 will be a good thing. It will recognize the sovereignty and inherent rights of First Nations. It will recognize the rights of self-determination and economic prosperity. It will recognize the commitment made by this government for a new partnership with First Nations in Canada. Thank you, senators. I appreciate it, Senator Tannas.
The Chair: Thank you, Chief Whitney, for your opening remarks. We’ll now move on to questions from senators.
Senator Arnot: Thank you, Chief Bobby Cameron, for coming here tonight. It’s nice to see you again. Chief Roy Whitney, this is the first time I’ve met you. Thanks for coming. I thank the two chiefs for being co-sponsors and leaders from the First Nations communities on this important bill. I also want to say hello to John Hill, my friend from a long time ago. He’s a well-known lawyer in Saskatchewan.
Chair, I do want to say that Chief Bobby Cameron was just elected for a fourth consecutive term. At the end of his term, he will be the longest-serving First Nations chief in the Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations. Congratulations, chief.
Just for my colleagues as well, the Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations was founded in the late 1940s. I would say it has been one of the most influential organizations and certainly one of the strongest proponents for treaty and Indigenous rights in the country. With that, thank you very much for coming.
I have a hardball question for you, Chief Cameron and Chief Whitney. I would like you to tell us how you envisage gaming, betting and lotteries and the funding those will generate as a tool for economic development and economic reconciliation in First Nations communities. I’d like you to comment on the employment that it will bring and how you see that as being a positive social impact that this bill will bring to your communities.
Mr. Cameron: Thank you for the question, senator. Obviously, with this particular bill and the spinoffs and the benefits that will come from it, the sky’s the limit — that is the way we look at it — for First Nations to take full advantage of this and to reinvest in the future. In my earlier comments, that was one of our visions moving forward: In 100 years from now, should this bill pass with your support into the House of Commons, it would continue to benefit First Nations communities, both on-reserve and off-reserve, and also the whole economy of Canada, because we’re true partners in this economy. We really are.
We fully support those individuals who seek interest or secure support to reinvest the extra revenue that is being generated, whether it’s in the area of gambling addictions or otherwise. Right now in First Nations country, we’re dealing with a deadly demon. Alcohol and drugs have taken many of our lives from coast to coast to coast.
Another tool that we can reinvest in is detox and wellness centres and healing centres to address and combat that deadly demon of alcohol and drugs. The spinoff of living a healthy lifestyle, by far, is going to benefit us. We look at this with a holistic approach, one that we take seriously. The protocols have taken place, and the prayers have been offered. Even getting to this point has been a sacred journey. You just have no idea how it feels in our hearts and minds that we’re getting closer, but we still have to get to the finish line.
To have this opportunity for First Nations to seek reinvestment in the healing and wellness that is so greatly needed in First Nations country, and to reinvest in those areas, is a huge starting point for us.
Mr. Whitney: In our community, if you know where we’re located, we’re adjacent to the city of Calgary. We’re presently building a multi-billion dollar development within the eastern boundary of our reserve, which is adjacent to Calgary. Our casino and hotel sits within that eastern boundary corridor that has been set aside and voted on by the people for the purposes of development.
We have the first Costco in a First Nations community in the world because of our development. We’ve created opportunities. Whatever spinoffs happen from the employment opportunities or the dollars that are created within our community, they go back out there to the City of Calgary. At our casino, right now we have 900 people who are employed. Most of those people come from the city of Calgary.
The dollars that are generated at our casino benefit the City of Calgary and the Province of Alberta a great deal. We are a large employer, and that’s just at our casino. That’s not including all of our other entities and enterprises, as well as our own administration. We generate a lot of wealth outside of our community.
This gives us an opportunity to build housing for our young people. We have such a growing population. We’re in the process of building a recovery centre with 75 beds on the western outskirts toward Bragg Creek and Redwood Meadows.
We are dealing with looking at the effects of life in general, not just how this affects people. We are generating opportunities that will create well-being for people.
Senator Coyle: Thank you very much to our witnesses for being with us this evening. And thank you for the work you have put in with our colleague and your visionary efforts to bring this bill forward, as well as the role that you’ve played and will continue to play as this is guided through the various processes here. I congratulate you.
I have so many questions, but you’ve answered a lot of them.
This is going to open bigger revenue opportunities for you. You get to keep it instead of giving it to the government — some of it. You get to keep all of it for yourselves and spend it in the ways you wish.
The businesses, the casinos, the resorts, the hotels, et cetera, are all money generators and employment generators. Regarding the revenue from those businesses — and you’ve talked about investing them in social infrastructure and housing and whatnot in your communities — do you also see them as sources of investment capital for other businesses in your communities for diversification of your economies? Could you speak to that?
Mr. Cameron: Thank you for the question, Senator Coyle.
We do 100%, without a doubt. It’s an opportunity to not just be a sponsor or secure loans for many sectors. As we said earlier, the sky is the limit.
It’s not just in that sector, but we also have many First Nations entrepreneurs who want to access and who want to do better because they’re educated, they’re knowledgeable and they’re just eager to seek that opportunity. That’s what we see this as. That’s what we look at this bill as. It’s going to bring more opportunities in that area for employment, revenue and everything else.
We have a guy by the name of Kevin Sapp who started from day one within the Saskatchewan Indian Gaming Authority, or SIGA, corporation. That man has been working for 28 or 29 years within the SIGA casino. He provided for his family. He bought himself a home. There are many successes that have happened and transpired since then, but there is much more to accomplish, with your comments. So 100%, we see that happening.
There is the lineup for our First Nations entrepreneurs and many others, obviously, because our gaming industry is inclusive. We’re inclusive of everybody 100%. We hire many employees of all religions and all ancestries, and we’re proud of that fact.
Mr. Whitney: Thank you, senator. We are investing in our community on prosperity in terms of economic opportunities. We have a shopping mall. We have a Costco. We have many other agreements that are on the table right now to be signed, and they’ll be building and starting construction next year. We have car lots. We have a Ford dealership. We have a Volvo dealership. We have Chrysler.
We have created within our community — not directly, but indirectly through our land — the employment numbers that go way beyond what other employment numbers might be in other situations outside of our community.
Senator Coyle: Chief Whitney, I think it was you who mentioned that 30% of the revenue goes to the province and 10% goes to non-host First Nations. Could you speak about that 10%? That’s prescribed by the province, I understand, right?
How does that sit with you? Where do you see that going, if anywhere, in the future under the new deal where you’re in charge, not the province?
Mr. Whitney: First of all, thank you for the question, senator. We give 30% — or 30% is taken by the province for their use and for themselves, and 10% is set aside for First Nations.
Like any other industry in other First Nations, whether it be in Alberta or wherever in Canada, there’s no expectation of them to provide revenues to us or to share their revenues, such as those who have oil reserves within their communities or gas reserves, or if they have mining within their communities or their territories.
We don’t have that same benefit. We’re expected to pay from our revenues that we create, and yet we’re the investors within our facilities. Those buildings are built with our hard-earned dollars.
I’m not averse to looking at what that might look like under a new arrangement, but that’s not something that we have decided, and that will be a discussion of all chiefs across the country who have casinos.
Terry Braun, General Counsel, Tsuut’ina Nation: Just in relation to the splits, as we call them, on the slots, we do give to the province that 30%, and then through the First Nations Development Fund, it’s an additional 10%.
I think one of the questions was “Well, where does it go?” It goes into the government coffers, and it’s now on an application basis for other First Nations — non-host First Nations — to essentially apply. It is then given back as a grant. Our money is being used by the provincial government as a grant back to other non-host First Nations.
Senator Coyle: As if it’s a government grant?
Mr. Whitney: Yes.
Mr. Braun: Exactly.
Senator Coyle: I see. Thank you.
Senator Prosper: Thank you, Chief Cameron, and congratulations. And, Chief Whitney, I want to recognize your leadership and your vision. It’s often not easy to step forward and put forward an initiative like this bill — in conjunction with Senator Tannas — that is, I think, rather key for the future. Chief Cameron, you mentioned that it will have an impact on future generations.
As a former chief within Nova Scotia, I got to experience development and see the benefits of how that development not only helps the community in terms of programming and services, but also this idea of own-source revenue being something that can foster growth.
Chief Cameron, you mentioned economic reconciliation, and I’m curious what you both — Chief Cameron and Chief Whitney — think when you think about economic reconciliation.
My second question relates to this: Chief Whitney, I think you mentioned there was a dilemma that you had where you either sign the agreement or you don’t have gaming. You mentioned the lack of or no consultation that was undertaken back in 1985 and later with these agreements between the feds and the province. What was the landscape of that negotiation that you entered into at the time with government?
The first question is about economic reconciliation and own-source revenue, and then my next question to you both is the background of the negotiation of those initial agreements.
Mr. Cameron: Thank you, Senator Prosper.
Economic reconciliation has been something that many of us across the country have been pursuing, and, in some cases, it has been successful. In this particular instance, the Lord willing, we will be successful with this bill.
Economic reconciliation takes on so many definitions. For the most part, it means improving the lives of First Nations people, both on-reserve and off-reserve. It means providing employment for First Nations people, both on-reserve and off-reserve. It means First Nations people can live a healthy lifestyle.
To achieve economic reconciliation brings these opportunities in so many factions and sectors. It brings more opportunities for First Nations people to be a part of something positive, not just the whole of Canada, but also in themselves with the dear Lord, our God, our Creator, so that they all understand that they can be part of something special and that they are special, because we’re all unique in our own way. We’re all unique because we all have feelings. The economic reconciliation, by far, will enhance what we’re trying to do as First Nations people, but also within your own selves and within your own families. On economic reconciliation, we all want our children and our grandchildren and those unborn to succeed. We all want our children to do better than we ever were, to make better choices than we ever had in life, and to be better people than we ever have been.
That’s what economic reconciliation means to us, senator. I want to turn it over to John Hill for the background at this time.
John C. Hill, Legal Counsel, Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations: Thank you, senator, for the question. I want to acknowledge those who did our protocols for us earlier today.
We have a unique history in gaming in Saskatchewan. As Chief Cameron mentioned, in 1993, the White Bear First Nation opened the first Indigenous-owned-and-operated casino in Saskatchewan. They did so as an assertion of their inherent and treaty rights. After it was open for three months, the Government of Saskatchewan — in a midnight paramilitary raid — raided the casino in the middle of the night and shut it down, purely based on their assertion of their right granted to the provinces under section 207 of the Criminal Code, which is why we’re seeking to have this changed. After that casino was closed, the Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations, or FSIN, entered into negotiations with the province, and there was an agreement signed in which the province would operate two casinos — operated by the province — and then 25% of the net revenue would come to First Nations. In answer to your previous question about employment, there was a target of 50% Indigenous employment.
After a year, it became clear they weren’t going to be able to operate two casinos, just one. So then there was a second agreement in which FSIN secured the right to operate four Indigenous-owned casinos, which is how the Saskatchewan Indian Gaming Authority, or SIGA, was born. It now operates seven casinos.
But through that, the province got the right and took, as the chief has indicated, 25% of the net revenue from First Nations for nothing other than the fact that they have the right to conduct and manage gaming under section 207. That’s why, as First Nations, we’re seeking parity with the provinces with this bill to seek the amendments so that no longer is necessary and so that as First Nations people, we don’t have to go hat in hand to another level of government and say, “Please let us keep our money.”
We have a revenue-sharing agreement in Saskatchewan that 50% of the net revenues we keep goes through an entity that we’ve created called the First Nations Trust, and that is shared equitably on a per capita basis to all First Nations in Saskatchewan. In particular, 25% is maintained within community development corporations operated by the host tribal councils. They use it for economic development and also share with non-Indigenous communities in their catchment areas. We have accountability to the provincial government. They have oversight of our expenditures in that way, whereas the government takes their $400 million, and, as Chief Whitney has indicated, they put it in their general revenue fund.
We do have a history in Saskatchewan where we started off opening casinos, but they were shut down, so we secured it by agreement, and all we’re asking is that section 207 be amended to give us parity with the provincial government so that we can do things the way we have been doing them for 30 years now.
Mr. Whitney: Thank you, senator. With the late premier Ralph Klein, whom I had a lot of respect for, it was through his discussions that we had within the province — and there were a number of First Nations and myself in particular, as well as the Chief of Enoch Cree Nation at the time, and those that have larger communities outside of their community where they might have boundaries to — that we became part of a discussion table to enter into the idea of gaming.
We were in the same position. We held a bingo within our community and opened it up to the public, but through the province, we were shut down because of illegal gaming, and yet those revenues were meant to benefit the community in our programs whereby we weren’t benefiting previously, such as our societies. Our museum society, our elder society and our youth society were not eligible at that time to receive the programs that were being offered by off-reserve casinos or bingos, and we then went into our own, so we were shut down in the same way. That’s when we entered into discussions.
As I said, it was not where we sat with a group of chiefs or even our own communities and said, “Is this something that we could live with?” It’s a policy; it’s not a law. A government can change that policy any time they choose. And it concerns me that it’s not going to be beneficial in the long run to our future generations. It’s our future generations that will benefit from this new Bill S-268. For us, the focus is how we ensure that there are own-source revenues for our young people coming forward, and they’re coming.
Senator Greenwood: Thank you again for being here this evening, and thank you for your opening remarks. This is a fairly new area for me, so forgive me if I’m asking something that you have maybe already spoken about.
As I listen to you speak about your relationship with the province — you know, giving monies — and then your intention and how you support your communities, can you talk a little bit more about the challenges that you’re facing and what difference this bill will make in addressing those challenges? This is federal legislation, but obviously you have a relationship with the province as well, so I’m just wanting to understand how those relationships will change as a result of this bill.
Then the second question I have — and it’s kind of where my heart is — is about some of the social challenges that may occur in the community and how you are addressing those. I was seeing those signs, such as Gamblers Anonymous and all that. How do we protect our communities as well and have supports for people who face those kinds of challenges?
If you could speak a bit about those two very different questions, I would appreciate it.
Mr. Cameron: Thank you, Senator Greenwood.
On the relationship with the provincial governments, the relationship with the federal government and even the relationships within our own family systems, there’s always going to be challenges, but that doesn’t stop us from trying to repair those relationships or trying to make things better. That’s why we’re elected to these positions: to manœuvre and to find that satisfactory resolve. And I believe we’re almost getting there.
With this bill, it will bring opportunities to reinvest in the healing and wellness aspect, such as the gambling addiction. We have what we call the First Nations Addictions Rehabilitation Foundation, where we allocate $2.5 million a year from our gaming revenues to deal with gambling addictions and other addictions. We look at this as an opportunity to not only help and heal our First Nations people, but also for them to take advantage of it. This is a very big topic for us, and it’s very important in addressing all concerns, so I want to thank you, senator, for your questions.
Mr. Whitney: Thank you, senator. For us, it was important that we keep building our human resource within our community, giving the skill sets that they will require as younger people to be able to enjoy the benefits that await them out in the world.
Being so close to the city of Calgary, it puts more pressure on us to maintain a lifestyle that’s going to be protective of who they are as Tsuut’ina people in their culture, traditions and beliefs as well as giving them the opportunity to receive education and be the modern-day warriors of the world, either in legal, finance or those different aspects.
That’s where we spend our time.
Mr. Braun, did you want to add to this? I’m not sure if I answered it properly.
Mr. Braun: Yes, if I may, senator, I think the first question was about the impact with the province, and there can be no doubt that there’s going to be an impact on the relationship with the province. If this bill goes through and First Nations decide to take jurisdiction over gaming, we may not be giving that half a billion dollars from Tsuut’ina back to the provincial government. There is certainly going to be an impact on the relationship.
But I would say this: I wanted to perhaps address the question about economic reconciliation and how this bill could be that shining example of economic reconciliation.
Rather than that half a billion dollars going to the province, that half a billion dollars stays in our community to provide for our people, and that would be the same for all the other gaming First Nations. Rather than the province taking that money and using that money for their benefit, it comes and stays with the First Nations. I wanted to make that comment.
Then there are the concerns about addictions and how we address things like that. I wasn’t legal counsel for Tsuut’ina at the time when they first considered a casino, but all of these issues were raised 20 years ago before we had a casino. What about addictions, prostitution and drugs? We’ve addressed it all. We’ve addressed it in that it’s not a problem of the casino. It is a problem outside of the casino, but within the casino, that’s not the cause of any of these problems. We have done a wonderful job addressing all of this. We’re confident that this bill isn’t going to change that. In fact, it is going to help it because we’re going to have more money that we can put into those resources.
Mr. Whitney: On another note, we did negotiate nine years ago with the Province of Alberta to have a ring road built through our community, and the people voted in favour of it. That was a negotiation that took place over a period of years, and it was with the Province of Alberta, the premier and the transportation minister, so we do have discussions that go on and negotiations that take place with the province that are not related to gaming.
But we also saw it as a benefit to our community because now we have a chance to really develop economically. We’ve taken advantage of that ring road, and we are now in this big development stage within Tsuut’ina Nation, and we’re very proud of what we’ve accomplished as a nation.
Because our population is growing so quickly, we need to keep finding new ways to create revenues to provide for housing and economic opportunities, whether it be private individuals seeking their own businesses or collectively as a nation.
Senator McNair: Thank you to the witnesses for being here tonight and for having this discussion. We appreciate you being here at this hour and having this discussion, as I said.
Chief Whitney, you had mentioned the development of guiding principles in the process that’s ongoing right now. I would like you to elaborate on that, if you could. Who is involved? When you see it being at a point where they’re ready to be adopted, who’s going to adopt it? How does the process work? It sounds like it’s a collaborative, cooperative process to date, and I wanted some more details on that.
Mr. Whitney: We are in discussions with the First Nations who have gaming within their communities, and we are developing an MOU as to how we work together collectively and develop a collective approach, knowing that each province is going to have their own set of guiding principles as well. I’m talking about the First Nations, not the government of the province. The First Nations will have their own guiding principles. That will be the same with us in Alberta. We will collectively determine what that looks like.
The two largest casinos in Alberta are Tsuut’ina and Enoch, and we create the most revenue outside to the Province of Alberta.
I’m going to let Mr. Braun answer the guiding principles process.
Mr. Braun: Thanks for the question. I was hoping somebody would ask that question. Almost from the day that the bill was first read, we recognized that we need to come up with a regulatory framework that gives everybody comfort that a change in the Criminal Code would not impact the integrity of gaming. We had reached out to some of the other gaming First Nations to start that discussion about what we could develop as an agreement amongst the host First Nations that would address that. Right now, there is a group that is working on an MOU. Honestly, we were hoping that we would be able to come before this committee and say, “We’ve got a signed MOU, and it has been signed by these First Nations.” We’re not quite there yet, but we’re hopeful to be there in the next couple of weeks.
In terms of some of the guiding principles, again, it would be integrity and transparency, cultural respect and sovereignty, responsible gaming, anti-money laundering and countering the financing of terrorism, player dispute resolution, and collaborative and best practices. We’ve worked through all of those guiding principles and tried to put some language around what it would look like with the intention that we’ll continue to try to work together to ensure that when this bill is enacted, there is a regulatory framework.
If I may, at this point, there is no decision as to what that regulatory framework looks like. Whether it’s a national regulatory body or a regional regulatory body, we’re just not there yet. We still have work to do, and we’re looking for input from other First Nations in terms of how they feel about the regulatory framework.
I can say again, senator, there is a commitment by this group. We will be meeting at the Assembly of First Nations. We’re going to have another three-day meeting in January or February. There is a real commitment to make sure that when this bill is enacted, we’ve got that regulatory framework.
Senator McNair: I commend you on that. It seems to go hand in hand with responsible gaming, thinking about these issues before the change.
Mr. Cameron: Further to that, the resolutions specific to the Indigenous Gaming Regulators framework were passed from the Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations assemblies and supported unanimously at the Assembly of First Nations chiefs-in-assembly. That work and everything else have started; those discussions have started. As Mr. Braun and Chief Whitney mentioned, we will be coordinating and organizing a more focused and thorough conversation on this regulatory framework. At this time, I want to ask John Hill to make a few comments.
Mr. Hill: Thank you, chief.
Thank you for the question. As Mr. Braun has said, the guiding principles are out there, and they’re being discussed.
When it comes to a regulatory framework, we need to remember this is not happening in a vacuum. We’re already in the business of gaming. Tsuut’ina is in the business of gaming. We in Saskatchewan already have our own Indigenous regulators. The Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations created a group called the Indigenous Gaming Regulators, and they license employees. They license charitable gaming in communities that delegate the authority. First Nations have the authority, and they have the jurisdiction. When they designate Indigenous Gaming Regulators as their regulator, we regulate charitable gaming in the communities. Indigenous Gaming Regulators is also now licensing gaming employees and gaming suppliers.
We’re not doing this in a vacuum. We recognize that consumer confidence must take place within the gaming industry. People need to be assured that gaming is fair and equitable and that there are rules to be followed. We’ve been doing that. That is not going to change. It is an absolutely necessary part.
It is the same with socially responsible gaming. The Saskatchewan Indian Gaming Authority, or SIGA, has responsible gaming programs. As the chief has indicated, the Federation of Sovereign Indigenous Nations, or FSIN, has created the First Nations Addictions Rehabilitation Foundation. We negotiated an amount with the Province of Saskatchewan, which has increased over the years. Currently, we take $2.5 million off the top, which goes to fund First Nations addictions in Saskatchewan. There is socially responsible gaming; there is a regulatory framework. We are in the business now. It shouldn’t frighten anyone. It’s going to be a new day, but it’s not something that we’re creating off a white page.
Senator Coyle: I believe you just answered my question. You are sophisticated operators of these businesses. You’ve been doing it for years. My question, which you’ve already answered, is whether there is now a move toward a more regional-level or national-level gaming commission model, and you’ve said “yes.” You’re moving in that direction. It’s not established yet, but it’s based on what you’ve already got going for yourselves. You’ve been regulating yourselves very well for a number of years, and now as others want to get into the business, or if you want to grow your business, maybe there is time to develop something that has standards across a larger geography. You’ve answered my question. Thank you.
Senator Tannas: I just wanted to talk specifically about that. My Scottish grandmother used to say that it is an ill wind that doesn’t blow some good. You can contrast where we are today versus where the United States was in the gaming industry and how it sprung up, disorganized with many stories about what not to do, whereas in our country across the provinces, we have at least 40 nations that have been doing this, in some cases, for decades. That is a good thing that there is this level of principle, sophistication and business savvy. I suppose it’s a long time coming.
Could you comment on that? How valuable is it and how less difficult is it, in your view, to come to an agreement with the other gaming nations on what the principles ought to be? You’ve all been running these businesses versus what happened in the United States, which is often in the back of people’s minds as a worry.
Mr. Cameron: Thank you, Senator Tannas, for the question. It’s an opportunity for First Nations who are in the gaming business to offer what we call the sacred journey of healing. It really is at a time when many First Nations across this country are looking for places to heal, looking for places to succeed and looking for places and opportunities to flourish, not only in the gaming industry, but in many sectors.
When our chiefs signed their treaty in the 1800s, they had a vision that in the year of 2024, these partnerships of our inherent treaty rights would continue to be promoted, protected and implemented, and this is one of them: the treaty right to livelihood. Senator Tannas, thank you for the question. That’s an important question and an important discussion to be had. As we move along in the next few months, we feel confident that we have the experience and the knowledge. Many of our folks are educated, and many have dedicated their whole lifetime to the gaming industry in order to see it succeed to this point and to see and avoid the wrongs of the past, and we’re there now. Thank you, senator.
The Chair: The time for this panel is now complete. I wish to thank all of you for joining us today. If you wish to make any subsequent submissions, please submit them by email to the clerk within seven days. Thank you.
(The committee adjourned.)