THE STANDING SENATE COMMITTEE ON NATIONAL FINANCE
EVIDENCE
OTTAWA, Tuesday, March 28, 2023
The Standing Senate Committee on National Finance met with videoconference this day at 9 a.m. [ET] to study the Main Estimates for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2024.
Senator Éric Forest (Deputy Chair) in the chair.
[Translation]
The Deputy Chair: I wish to welcome all the senators, as well as the Canadians across the country who are watching us on sencanada.ca.
My name is Éric Forest. I am a senator from the province of Quebec, representing the Gulf region, and I am the deputy chair of the Senate Committee on National Finance.
Now, I would like to go around the table and have my fellow senators introduce themselves.
Senator Gignac: Good morning. I am Clément Gignac, a senator from Quebec.
Senator Galvez: Good morning. I am Rosa Galvez, an independent senator from Quebec.
Senator Loffreda: Good morning. I am Tony Loffreda from Quebec. Welcome everyone.
[English]
Senator Boehm: Peter Boehm, Ontario.
Senator Duncan: Good morning. Pat Duncan, senator for Yukon.
Senator Pate: Kim Pate from the Kitchissippi, the unceded, unsurrendered territories of the Algonquin Anishinaabeg.
Senator Smith: Larry Smith, Quebec.
Senator Marshall: Elizabeth Marshall, Newfoundland and Labrador.
[Translation]
Senator Dagenais: I am Jean-Guy Dagenais from Quebec.
The Deputy Chair: Thank you.
I also want to acknowledge our clerk, Mireille K. Aubé, and our analysts, Sylvain Fleury and Shaowei Pu. Without their support, we would be hard-pressed to do this work so efficiently.
[English]
This morning, we are continuing our study on the Main Estimates for the fiscal year ending March 31, 2024, which was referred to this committee on March 7, 2023, by the Senate of Canada.
[Translation]
To assist us with this study, we have with us senior officials from Global Affairs Canada and Veterans Affairs Canada. Welcome to all of you, and thank you for accepting our invitation to appear before the Senate National Finance Committee.
Since there are many of you, I will introduce the two people who are making the opening statements, and I will ask the others to introduce themselves if they are asked to speak.
We will now hear opening remarks from Anick Ouellette, Assistant Deputy Minister and Chief Financial Officer at Global Affairs Canada. Go ahead, Ms. Ouellette.
Anick Ouellette, Assistant Deputy Minister and Chief Financial Officer, Global Affairs Canada: Good morning. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. It is an honour to be here this morning to discuss my department’s Main Estimates.
I would first like to acknowledge that I am speaking from the traditional unceded territory of the Algonquin Anishinaabe people, and I am grateful to have the opportunity to be present on this territory.
[English]
I am joined today by Weldon Epp, Assistant Deputy Minister, Indo-Pacific; Annie Boyer, Director General, Financial Planning and Management, and Deputy Chief Financial Officer; Andrew Smith, Director General, International Assistance Policy; Glen Linder, Director General, North America; Geneviève Brown, Executive Director, Climate Finance; and Kati Csaba, Executive Director, Ukraine Bureau.
Let me begin by outlining the scope of our mandate.
Under the leadership of three ministers, Global Affairs Canada is responsible for advancing Canada’s international relations; developing and implementing foreign policy; promoting international trade while supporting Canadian business interests; being a leader in delivering international development assistance, including humanitarian assistance; and providing consular assistance to many Canadians who work, live and travel abroad.
[Translation]
In order to fulfill this mandate and to position Canada as a global leader, Global Affairs Canada operates 178 missions in 110 countries in an evolving and often challenging global political and economic climate.
Compared with the 2022-23 Main Estimates, the 2023-24 Main Estimates have increased by $107.6 million. The increase is mainly due to the new funding requested to support Canada’s Feminist International Assistance Policy and the Peace and Stabilization Operations Program.
The additional funding sought through these Main Estimates will allow Canada to demonstrate to Canadians and the world that our values and actions can make a real contribution to addressing the impact of climate change in developing countries, addressing the needs of the most vulnerable people in the world through the humanitarian-development-peace and security nexus, and ensuring quality service to Canadians, particularly those requiring consular assistance abroad.
[English]
The net increase of $107.6 million in this year’s Main Estimates is mainly attributable to the following items. In terms of increases, $76.8 million is to further the implementation of the Feminist International Assistance Policy through incentives shaped by the policy to refocus Canada’s global development and humanitarian efforts on advancing gender equality, and the rights and empowerment of women and girls, as well as to support initiatives under the innovative financing programs composed of the International Assistance Innovation Program and the Sovereign Loans Program.
There is $32.5 million to support the Peace and Stabilization Operations Program by addressing Canada’s commitment to further the women’s and peace security agenda on the global stage; strengthen engagement in the UN to promote its effectiveness and the rules-based international order; and expand engagement with allies, partners and international organizations in order to promote peace and security.
There is $32.3 million related to transfers to or from other government departments to provide support to departmental staff located at missions abroad.
[Translation]
An increase of $23.1 million will help developing countries to address the impact of climate change through transition towards more low-carbon, climate-resilient and nature-positive economies. A total of $21.4 million is related to inflation on overseas operating costs, and $16.8 million will help to reinforce and modernize core consular capacity to assist Canadians abroad.
[English]
In terms of the decrease, there’s a decrease of $97 million related to a strategic priorities fund due to funding of $40 million in additional support to the Access to COVID-19 Tools (ACT) Accelerator and international humanitarian assistance efforts, and a $50-million transfer to the Department of Finance to support the International Monetary Fund’s poverty reduction and growth.
The funding will support Canada’s role in addressing major global issues while also reinforcing Canadian leadership. Programming will be guided by country needs and will be implemented by trusted partners.
[Translation]
The department continues to measure performance and communicate results to Parliament and Canadians. We emphasize responsible financial management to deliver our mandate and ensure the highest standards of service to Canadians, particularly those requiring consular assistance abroad.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. We would be pleased to address any questions you may have.
[English]
The Deputy Chair: Thank you very much. Now we will hear from Mr. Steven Harris.
Steven Harris, Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery Branch, Veterans Affairs Canada: Mr. Chair and members, I and Jonathan Adams, the Acting Director General of Finance and Acting Chief Financial Officer, are pleased to join you today to discuss our department’s 2023-24 Main Estimates.
Veterans Affairs Canada’s mission is to provide services and benefits that respond to the needs of veterans and their families. The majority of Veterans Affairs’ programs are demand-driven. This means that our own funding requirements are based on estimates of how many veterans will come forward to request support over the course of a year. These estimates, as you know, can fluctuate from one year to the next and also through the course of a calendar year. In 2022-23, for example, the $5.5 billion in our estimates represented a 12.5% decrease from the year before. On the other hand, the Main Estimates for 2023-24 total $5.98 billion, which represents a net increase of $477 million, or 8% more than, the Main Estimates from last year.
As always, over 90% of this funding is going toward veterans and their families for things such as pain and suffering compensation, income replacement benefits and the Veterans Independence Program. The funding is being used to extend resources to continue our mission to reduce wait times for disability benefits. As you know, Mr. Chair, this has been a critical area of focus for our department. Our backlog currently sits around 6,800 cases, which is more than a 70% reduction from its peak of more than 23,000 in 2020. I’m pleased to report that as of right now we’re on track to be meeting our service standard by this summer.
Some of the funding is also earmarked for a Mental Health Benefits program. As you might recall, this program was introduced in April of 2022. It allows veterans to receive mental health care immediately, when applying for disability benefits for eligible mental health conditions. Funding is also being used to extend temporary resources to support case management, which will allow veterans affairs to keep delivering the kind of compassionate care that our most vulnerable veterans deserve.
[Translation]
Remembering our fallen is also an important aspect of what Veterans Affairs Canada, or VAC, does. That is why, Mr. Chair, we also have funding going towards the maintenance and modernization of Canada’s two national historic sites overseas: the Canadian National Vimy Memorial and the Beaumont-Hamel Newfoundland Memorial. Both of these places hold special significance for Canadians. It’s important that we invest in their upkeep — both to properly recognize, respect and honour the sacrifice of our veterans and so all Canadians who visit these sites can experience them to their fullest.
Finally, with the Invictus Games returning to Canada in February 2025, we’re allocating funding to support the games and our athletes who will be competing in Vancouver-Whistler in just under two years’ time.
As for the 8% increase in the estimates, Mr. Chair, it can be accounted for largely by an increase in demand for VAC’s programs. For example, you will see an increase of $266 million related to Pain and Suffering Compensation, which compensates Canadian Armed Forces members and veterans for the pain and suffering they experience due to a disability caused by a service-related illness and/or injury.
We are also forecasting a $122-million increase in demand for the Income Replacement Benefit, and a $72-million increase for our Additional Pain and Suffering Compensation. Veterans receive this tax-free benefit monthly. It helps those veterans who have a severe, permanent disability from their service that creates challenges for them in their daily lives.
[English]
The operating budget for the department has grown by $50 million in comparison to the previous Main Estimates, mostly related to the extension of temporary resources, support disability benefits, case management, services and to manage the mental health benefit. Mr. Chair, we owe Canada’s veterans an enormous debt for their services to our country and the sacrifices made along the way. Funding these Main Estimates will help us meet a standard of service and care that lives up to the expectations of Canada’s veterans’ community. Thank you.
The Deputy Chair: Thank you very much for your statements.
[Translation]
We will now move into questions and answers.
[English]
Senators, you will have a maximum of five minutes each for the first round.
[Translation]
You will have a maximum of three minutes each for the second round. Senators, please ask your questions directly, and, witnesses, please respond concisely. The clerk will inform me when your time is up.
[English]
Senator Marshall: Welcome to all of our witnesses. I’m going to start with Mr. Harris and I’m going to pick up where I left off a year ago.
You said that you have the backlog of applications down to 6,800. Last year you thought you might get it down to 5,000, and you hired some more staff to help out. Have you looked at the reason why you didn’t meet your target? In your answer, could you indicate the number of veterans in Canada now at this point in time. I was wondering if that had any impact on not reaching your backlog?
Mr. Harris: The reason for our target, and being just outside of our target at this point in time, was related to demand-driven elements. That is, the number of veterans coming forward and seeking disability benefits and the number of staff we had on hand to be able to process it. The government has been generous in giving us additional temporary resources. That takes some time to hire and train. As well, in terms of the extension of the temporary resources that we had, we were able to do that, but only close to the end of the initial temporary period that we had. As such, some of our employees determined that they needed to find more stable, permanent employment, and some of them left. We have nurses, adjudicators, and others, that take some time to recruit and train, who decided to leave for more stable employment in other departments and in other areas of the country.
Senator Marshall: How many applications did you process last year? I think the number we had last year was 23,000 in the queue, and about half, I think, was over 16 weeks. For last year, my number says 18,000. How many did you process in reality?
Mr. Harris: We processed a lot more than that. I’ll come to that in just a second. The number you’re referencing, 23,000, are beyond our 16-week service standard and that’s the number we have down to about 6,800, so about a 70% reduction. On average on an annual basis we get about 70,000 applications. Some of those end up being withdrawn. There’s no formal decision made because there’s not enough information in the file, but that still takes some work. In terms of decisions, we make an additional number of decisions on top of what we’re receiving at this point, given the additional resources that we have.
Senator Marshall: So 16 weeks is still your target time. How many veterans are there in Canada now? The number I had was 630,000. I realize the programs are demand-driven, but can you give us that number?
Mr. Harris: I don’t have that number right in front of us. We did have 630,000 that we had been estimating as veterans in Canada. With the release of the most recent census, it’s just over 400,000. The department has been calculating the number of veterans in Canada based on a formula since it was removed from the census in the 1970s. We’ve been making estimates for it over the years. That’s the 600,000 figure that has been seen over the last number of years. Now that this question has been readded to the census, we have a more precise figure. That number is just over 400,000.
Senator Marshall: Just over 400,000. I was reading the report of the Veterans Ombudsman. She made several recommendations. What happens to those recommendations? The one that I’m especially interested in, from my understanding in reading the report, has to do with the lump-sum disability award that was replaced with pain and suffering, which is more, I guess, monthly. She said that based on the formula, it was very complex, but it was beneficial to the veteran until you get to a certain point. Has that issue been addressed? What happens to the recommendations?
Mr. Harris: All our ombudsperson’s recommendations are considered by the department and we’re able to implement them, partially implement them or unable to implement them either due to policy or legislative changes that might be required in time.
With respect to the number of recommendations that the ombudsperson made around pensions and compensation for pain and suffering, in 2019, we introduced a new pension-for-life program which includes three benefits: Pension, a Pain and Suffering Compensation, Additional Pain and Suffering Compensation and Income Replacement Benefit. Those three programs must be taken together to really consider the fulsome opportunity to be able to give money to veterans.
Senator Marshall: Was her recommendation implemented?
Mr. Harris: It has not been implemented, no.
[Translation]
Senator Gignac: Welcome to all the witnesses. Thank you for the work you do.
My question is for Ms. Ouellette or any other member of your team. In the Main Estimates, Global Affairs Canada is requesting $2.8 billion in transfer payments for grants under International Development Assistance for Multilateral Programming. That’s an increase of 10.8%, if I’m not mistaken, over last year.
Can you tell us the reasons or key factors that account for the 10.8% increase?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for your question.
Yes, there is an increase over last year. As I mentioned in my opening remarks, the increase is due mainly to the implementation of Canada’s Feminist International Assistance Policy, so $76.8 million, and the Peace and Stabilization Operations Program, including efforts deployed in Ukraine.
Approximately $23 million was allocated under programming to address the impacts of climate change. This is an increase in relation to the grants and contributions increase.
Those are the three main areas where funding increases are anticipated for the next fiscal year.
Senator Gignac: Performance-wise, what percentage of international development targets did you meet last year or in the previous fiscal year? I’m sure you set targets and measure your results. How did you do, then?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for your question.
Senator Gignac: Do you have targets to assess your international development programming?
Ms. Ouellette: Yes, of course. We are in the process of finalizing that information for 2022-23. Today is March 28, the end of the fiscal year. If I’m not mistaken, you were asking about the commitments and targets in the list. For Africa, we are hoping to achieve 50% of our programming. We were at 48% in 2021-22. For gender-based programming, we were at 10.3% in 2021-22, and for education, it was 7.5%. In a nutshell, those were the targets.
Owing to the core increase, so in the divisor, and COVID expenditures, for the most part, the targets are a bit harder to meet, because the COVID funding is targeted and does not impact the percentages for education, gender or, to a certain extent, Africa.
[English]
Senator Smith: Mr. Harris, your organization’s departmental plan of 2023-24, there’s a mention of several mandate letter commitments, including the MLC 1, which states.
We will improve our services by strategically using data and new technologies such as artificial intelligence (AI) and automated process flows to minimize processing times so that Veterans can access benefits and services in a timely manner.
I have three questions.
In what way is the department using artificial intelligence, or AI, to reduce wait times for assistance, and how is it being measured?
Also, what is the department doing to protect veterans’ personal data?
Third, because 33% of all veterans will be 70 years or older in the next 5 years, can you provide detail on how the department is working with older veterans who may not necessarily have access to technology or know how to navigate the various veterans-related programs on their own?
Mr. Harris: I’ll start with the last question first.
We’ve had a lot of experience in working with the elderly population in terms of our veteran population; we’ve been doing that consistently over many decades, frankly. That said, to your question of how we are working with them when we are trying to, at the same time, digitize and modernize the way we do some services, we continue to work with them in very direct ways.
Many of them are already our clients, long before they come into old age. We do things which are direct reach outs. Even during the pandemic, we were doing direct call-outs and reach outs to veterans who would be considered vulnerable, elderly veterans, veterans living on their own, and veterans with high levels of disability, to see if they were doing okay or if they needed additional assistance.
We have people who will work with them in terms of any change they have to their requirements. We will have people who will call them, speak with them, ask them if there are any changes to their actual needs that they require.
Senator Smith: You mentioned earlier that you had people who would look for other employment. There were some stability issues during COVID. How did that affect you answering the questions that I have just asked you?
Mr. Harris: Yes. Some of the additional staff we brought on for disability benefit processing specifically, nurses who do disability benefit adjudication and other things, were the most likely to be in demand to go other places if they do not have permanent and stable employment with us.
The kind of outreach that we are doing, particularly for elderly veterans, tends to be some of our other front-line service workers, people who are veteran service agents or case managers who may be reaching out in that way. They weren’t really affected during that time. We didn’t lose many of those folks to other employment. They were continuing to be able to do that, to reach out and directly speak with them.
We make allowances for veterans who are elderly, but others who may not be fully adaptable to technology. Veterans with mental health challenges or difficulties may not necessarily be well suited to using a computer for complex applications. We do the same thing with them as well, not just elderly veterans, veterans who might be in need and have requirements.
Senator Smith: Is there only one measurement, the total number of requests, or are there other measurements that you use to make sure that your veterans are getting the proper service?
Mr. Harris: We have a couple of measures, some measures around our programming. How many people are accessing our programming? How many people are using it?
We have a national client survey that we do on an annual or biannual basis to reflect whether or not clients of all ages and levels of ability or disability are able to connect with us and seek programming as well. There are a couple of different metrics we use for those. We have indicators of veterans’ health and well-being as well. How many veterans are doing well with respect to their own challenges?
We have the Veterans Independence Program which has been in place for decades to help veterans stay in their homes. People do better when they stay in their homes and are not required to leave for long-term care facilities. We use things like housekeeping, groundskeeping, in-home services to be able to enable them to stay in their homes longer, particularly those elderly veterans whom we have as well.
If I may, I can answer your other two questions as well.
Senator Smith: Okay.
Mr. Harris: With respect to privacy, we follow all the rules of the Privacy Act. We make sure veterans’ information is protected in any use that we have for it in terms of the information that they’re supplying to us: Personal information, medical information, interactions with their health professional teams as well.
We have other service delivery providers that we work with, contracts that are in place with expertise to be able to help support veterans in delivering services, whether that is rehabilitation, access to treatment benefits, health claims administration as well. We have a number of safeguards in place that are aligned with the Privacy Act to make sure that veterans’ information isn’t shared inappropriately.
Senator Smith: Thank you.
Senator Loffreda: Thank you to our panellists for being here this morning.
I will stay with Veterans Affairs Canada, which is extremely important. You mentioned programs are demand-driven. In the 2023-24 Main Estimates, you have close to $6 billion for Veterans Affairs. You mentioned there was an increase of 8%, which is correct.
My question is: Is the 8% increase inflation-driven, or is there an increased demand from veterans in order to assist them? Several years ago, in fact, in 2015, the Senate’s Subcommittee on Veterans Affairs published the Interim Report on the Operational Stress Injuries of Canada’s Veterans.
During its study, the committee heard from officials of the Canadian Armed Forces and Veterans Affairs Canada, and their efforts to improve and reach out to reservists. The pandemic has accelerated that need, I can imagine, especially in the fields of virtual and mental health.
How is that $6 billion being spent? Is there an increase because it is an increase in demand? How are our veterans faring at this point in time?
Jonathan Adams, Acting Director General and Acting Chief Financial Officer, Finance, Veterans Affairs Canada: Thank you for the question. In response, there are two key factors, you are absolutely right; it is both an impact for cost of living and inflation, and also veteran demand.
With our Veteran Affairs program, across all of them, we do adjust for cost of living increases each year. For 2023, based on Statistics Canada’s consumer price index, we did increase our benefits going forward by 6.6% based on the changes for inflation through the 2022 calendar year. That is a factor for the services and benefits that are available.
In addition to that, with all of our quasi-statutory programs, we do adjust for all the expected demand for all of those programs. As Mr. Harris highlighted right now, we are processing over 70,000 applications a year for disability benefits. Those clients are then coming in and accessing our programs.
As highlighted in the opening comments, the three primary programs that are driving that increase, in addition to the normal cost-of-living pieces, are our Pension for Life programs, which includes: Pain and Suffering Compensation, Additional Pain and Suffering Compensation and Income Replacement Benefit. Those three items together accounted for $377 million of the increase.
Senator Loffreda: Thank you. I’ll continue with Veterans Affairs. I know that Veterans Affairs play a leading role in honouring our veterans and commemorating key milestones in our military and peacekeeping history. It’s important to pay tribute to these important legacies. There is nearly $42 million in the Main Estimates for commemorations for Veterans Affairs Canada. I ask the question because I serve as an honorary patron of the International Forum on Peace, Security and Prosperity, and they’re organizing, The Walk for Remembrance & Peace and a conference in Italy this summer to honour the 1943 Italian campaign’s 80-year anniversary, but I notice there is no mention of this in your departmental plan. In fact, the organization is hosting its hybrid forum today and tomorrow. I wonder if you have considered the D-Day Dodgers, honouring them. They made an impactful contribution to the Second World War.
Mr. Adams: As highlighted through the Main Estimates, there are a number of areas supporting the commemoration. This is an important area across many of the activities that we do to commemorate our veterans across the country, both domestically and internationally.
As was announced through Budget 2022 and the Fall Economic Statement, we have increased funding for preserving our monuments and improving the visitor experience in areas like the Beaumont-Hamel Newfoundland Memorial as well as the Canadian National Vimy Memorial’s Visitor Information Centre — that’s $11 million over five years — as well as funding for the Invictus Games coming up in 2025, and it was announced with $16 million over three years for those particular commemoration and supportive activities.
In relation to the broader question, I will turn it over to Steven Harris.
Mr. Harris: Thanks. We can’t, unfortunately, note necessarily all of the commemorative milestones coming up over the course of a particular year. What we do is try to highlight —
Senator Loffreda: Well, now you know of one.
Mr. Harris: We try and highlight as many as we can in areas where we might focus. We’re doing some additional domestic commemoration events this year. As senators may have seen in Ottawa, the ice storm installation that we had done recently to commemorate the Canadian Armed Forces’ involvement in the ice storm 25 years ago, and other things such as the upcoming commemoration of the Swissair disaster. We are always looking to partner with organizations that are looking to commemorate our veterans, so I will certainly take that back to my colleagues who work specifically in the commemoration area with respect to the work going on right now.
Senator Loffreda: Thank you for doing that. If you need any insights on that, please do get back to me. I’m honoured to be an honorary patron of this event that is commemorating the soldiers that liberated Italy in the Second World War.
[Translation]
Senator Dagenais: Ms. Ouellette, Prime Minister Trudeau announced that he planned to provide $100 million in aid to Haiti. Since a number of aid programs in Haiti have failed, can you tell us how that money will be spent? It’s been shown that unscrupulous leaders have often used aid money to line their pockets.
Will you be putting new controls in place? If so, who will be responsible for monitoring the spending? Also, where will the additional $100 million come from? Is it just a new political announcement that you weren’t made aware of ahead of time?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for your question. Obviously, Canada is concerned about the situation in Haiti. Yes, we will coordinate the efforts of all the departments to support Haiti. This will include measures targeting security and the Haitian National Police to build diplomatic capacity and enhance dialogue. Other measures will likely include sanctions and humanitarian assistance.
As you pointed out, the $100 million was just announced, so it’s not in these Main Estimates for the department. As for where the funding will be drawn from, that has yet to be determined. My understanding is that it’s still being discussed at the political level.
I can already tell you that, to date, in 2023, our department has provided $12.3 million in humanitarian assistance. Last year, it was about $10 million.
As for due diligence and funding controls, we have mechanisms to make sure that the money is spent as intended. The organizations we deal with have carried out a financial and fiduciary risk assessment. The level of risk informs our oversight measures. Funding recipients are regularly audited, and formal audits by the Office of the Auditor General are always possible.
Senator Dagenais: Now I would like to discuss the UN and Canada’s obligation under the peacekeeping program. The UN’s humanitarian aid plan for Haiti calls for $373 million in funding, but, apparently, only 14% of that money has been provided to date.
Will the recently announced $100 million be part of that global assistance? What is Canada’s position, and what are the costs under the UN’s aid plan?
Ms. Ouellette: I’m going to have to get back to you on the $100 million, in terms of whether it will go towards the $373 million. Our department works closely with the UN to deploy humanitarian assistance.
Senator Dagenais: Will you get back to the committee in writing?
Ms. Ouellette: Yes.
Senator Dagenais: Thank you very much, Ms. Ouellette.
The Deputy Chair: Thank you. You’re keeping me on my toes — 3 minutes and 30 seconds.
[English]
Senator Boehm: Thank you to our witnesses for being here. My questions are all for Global Affairs Canada. Probably not a big surprise.
Ms. Ouellette, when I was a junior Foreign Service officer, the deputy minister came and spoke to us once and said, “Whatever you do, make sure that what you do does not end up on the front page of The Globe and Mail.” Today, there is an article on the front page of The Globe and Mail referring to the Auditor General’s report in terms of how difficult it is to measure the impact of the Feminist International Assistance Policy. I know that in terms of estimates and everything, this policy initiative is drawn through multilateral and bilateral work and in some cases it involves partners that are multilateral and other partners on the ground. There is a duration issue too in terms of projects.
I’m wondering whether you could explain a little bit what the difficulties are in that respect. I have a few other questions too.
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you, Senator Boehm, for the question. You’re right; there was the report from the OAG that came out yesterday with four main findings related to information management, witnesses, incomplete sets of key performance indicators and that intersectionality was not considered enough in gender equality assessment and the fact that we didn’t meet all the targets that I was referring to earlier in the conversation.
There are three recommendations, of course, related to the necessity to invest in an information management system and practices, to adjust the performance indicator to measure output and outcomes and to consider any factors that go beyond age and projected level and gender equality assessment.
The department has agreed to the three recommendations and has drafted a management response. We are in the midst of developing a more detailed action plan, but let me speak about the information management aspect, where I have a role to play.
In terms of the limitations or the challenges you mentioned, the fact that we work in a department where we have several information management systems doesn’t help us. Therefore, through a new initiative called the Transforming Global Affairs Canada initiative, we want to better organize ourselves in terms of information management to make sure we are able to do the oversight, follow-up and due diligence efforts that are easily accessible and documented, because that was —
Senator Boehm: Thank you. I will interrupt you there. That’s great, but I know there are some other challenges, so what I was looking for were assurances — and you have provided those — that you will be acting on the recommendations of the Auditor General.
My next question is with regard to assessed contributions to international organizations. There is a whole list of them here. Canada has traditionally had a reputation for paying on time and in full. As I recall, having been a representative to an international institution at one point where I was at the Organization of American States, if you paid on time and in full, you received a 2% discount. At least in my time, we did receive that. That was an incentive for countries that were in arrears and not paying.
Do you know if programs like that still exist or if that’s something that Canada could garner an advantage on, since we’re always the good guys who pay on time and in full, and others take the ride, as it were?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for the question, Senator Boehm. I’m not aware of that 2% discount. I will need to check with my colleagues within the department to see if that is something that is still available or that we can advocate for.
Senator Boehm: Thank you for that.
[Translation]
Do I have any time left?
The Deputy Chair: You have 30 seconds.
Senator Boehm: I’ll wait until the second round, then.
[English]
Senator Duncan: Thank you to the witnesses for coming here this morning and testifying before us.
I’d like to direct my questions to Veterans Affairs. Part of my lifetime of work was with the Workers’ Compensation Board, including managing, adjudicating and appearing before the workers’ tribunal. I was interested in the ombudsperson’s report and information, as I believe that to be the appeal process. Is that appeal process clearly laid out for all the veterans; you emphasized the communication with veterans, so is the appeal process on decisions clearly outlined to them?
Mr. Harris: In every application we get, when we render a decision, the appeal rights for any declined decision are clearly laid out in the letters.
For disability benefits, we have a particular track for appeals, which includes a Bureau of Pension Advocates. That is a team of lawyers that exists within the department to assist veterans in preparing their cases to be presented ultimately before a Veterans Review and Appeal Board, which will render decisions on those kinds of applications for disability benefits.
Regarding other types of benefits, there are two internal levels of appeals for other benefits that may be in question for veterans. They are able to come through and go through two levels of appeal in that sense before they also have the option of going to a veteran’s ombudsperson, with whom we work with closely on individual cases on any systemic pieces, to make sure we are correcting any errors or mistakes that are made.
Senator Duncan: If I understand you correctly, there is an appeal process and then also the ombudsperson?
Mr. Harris: Correct.
Senator Duncan: Is there a report I can access of how the appeal numbers stack up?
Mr. Harris: Sure. The Veterans Review and Appeal Board, which is a quasi-judicial board that is separate from VAC but in the same portfolio, would issue a report every year. Also, the ombudsperson issues a report every year to ensure any complaints are tracked through her office as well.
Senator Duncan: Are there time frames included on how well they’re doing?
Mr. Harris: There are time frames, but I can’t necessarily answer on behalf to have the Veterans Review and Appeal Board. It has always been a challenge in terms of ensuring that those appeal time frames can be met — as well as the additional number of decisions we’ve been making since we’ve been able to get additional staff and make more decisions. That has resulted in some other additional work in terms of appeals coming through the system as well, and they don’t necessarily have all of the resources to be able to do that either. In some cases, they’re not able to meet their service standard either.
Senator Duncan: I can gain that information looking at the reports, but does Veterans Affairs also publish or have, internally, a map of where your resources — where our veterans are located, where these appeals are coming from — and decisions and resources?
Mr. Harris: I’m not sure we publish a map in the way you’re describing, but I’m sure if we get some further information from you, we’d be happy to provide some additional information that we have that we could share with the senator to make sure we’re answering the question.
Senator Duncan: I want to know where the resources are and where our veterans are across the country. Also, I want to know where the appeal discussions are coming from and where you might be hearing of situations.
I’m asking because there is quite a parallel between what you offer and what resources you’re looking for, as well as provincial and territorial resources. Of course, every government is looking for more people and resources. I’m curious if there is a correlation between the two. If you’ve reduced your cases significantly, if that’s also coherent with what the provinces and territories have initiated.
Mr. Harris: We continue to do a lot of work to ensure we have services in the right place for veterans. We have taken the new census data, and we also have our existing list of clients of Veterans Affairs. We make sure we have services at our approximately 60 in-person offices across the country, either on bases or in cities and towns.
The appeals can be held in local communities as well. The Veterans Review and Appeal Board travels across the country to do those hearings. Then we are trying to ensure there are support services for veterans in any area where they are located.
The COVID pandemic allowed us to do some things remotely, both for the department but also in terms of health service providers that work with veterans. While veterans may be located in remote areas across the country, we’ve been able to lean into services for occupational stress injuries and things like that remotely because of the improvements in direct delivery to veterans by health service providers over the course of COVID.
Senator Duncan: Thank you very much.
[Translation]
Senator Galvez: Thank you to all the witnesses for being here today.
[English]
My question is directed to Global Affairs Canada. First, I am so happy to see that some funds now are directly related to fighting climate change in developing countries. That is important. Some amounts are small, but I think the efforts and the intentions are there.
I was in Egypt last year, and we talked about losses and damage. There was the case of Pakistan and its horrible flood. A third of the country was under water. There were talks that it was going to be used as a model to calculate how much restoration and reconstruction would cost. From that, there would be calculations of the fair share for loss and damage.
What are those calculations for Canada? How did we arrive at the amounts that we have been provided? How close or how far away are we from our fair share? Thank you.
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you, Senator Galvez, for the question.
In the Main Estimates, we have a considerable amount of the $382 million to address climate change. This is from the envelope of the $5.3 billion that was announced by the Prime Minister in June 2021.
In terms of the calculation in Pakistan, maybe I’ll turn to my colleague Geneviève Brown to answer the question. Thank you.
Geneviève Brown, Executive Director, Climate Finance, Global Affairs Canada: Good morning. Thank you for the question.
In terms of the calculation for the particular amount that is considered fair share for Canada, this is not a fixed, determined calculation. This is part of how Canada contributes to the $1 billion goal for what is being raised for climate change.
In terms of loss and damage, these are conversations that are ongoing now, after COP 27, to see how we determine and how we will negotiate what contributions and how we define loss and damage.
I’d be happy to follow up with additional information in terms of where we’re at, but that is an ongoing conversation at the moment.
Senator Galvez: Thank you. We have EDC, or Export Development Canada, and among the funds that you are releasing, you have assistance to commerce for exports. Is there any overlap with what is given to EDC, or are they completely different funds?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for the question. Yes, we do have an amount for what we call the CanExport which supports small- and medium-sized enterprise in Canada to export and to look for markets around the world.
Regarding the EDC, I don’t know exactly their programming and policies, but I don’t think there is an overlap with us. I’d be happy to provide further information.
Senator Galvez: I’d like very much to know how you operate.
Ms. Ouellette: The delineation of roles between the two organizations? Yes; sure.
Senator Galvez: Thank you.
Senator Pate: Thank you to all of our witnesses for being here and for your work. My questions will be toward Veterans Affairs Canada.
I notice in your request that you’ve requested for both the pain and suffering compensation, although it’s been replaced by the disability award requesting in both areas. I’m curious. I suspect that’s a bit of overlap. I’m going to ask both my questions.
In your 2022 Auditor General’s report, there was mention of the fact that the wait times for francophones and women were longer, but the most recent ombudsperson’s report indicates special teams to address the issue with women. I’m curious as to where you are with the wait times for francophones.
Not to micromanage, but I have a suggestion for you based on being the daughter of a veteran and trying to assist with some of these processes. First, I’ll let you answer my questions.
Mr. Adams: Sure. In response to the question around the Main Estimates, specifically with both disability awards and the pain and suffering compensation, the pain and suffering compensation were introduced in April 2019 as part of the new suite of pension-for-life programs. As highlighted, there is a requested increase of $266 million for this. This is to support the increased capacity of those resources to process disability applications.
Regarding the Disability Award program, which is being phased out, there are still a number of clients — 83, to be specific — that are receiving a periodic payment. The increase request here is to support those clients receiving that amount. They have the ability to transition over at their request, but this is to support all of those still accessing that program with that monthly amount.
Mr. Harris: If I may, with respect to disability wait times for francophone applicants and for women and men, there were significant gaps between men and women in terms of the application wait times. We’ve put in place a team that’s dedicated to processing applications from women veterans. We’ve been able to reduce that gap to essentially zero. For the first three quarters, the difference between wait times for men and women veterans applying for benefits is essentially zero. It might be 0.2 of a week, something of that nature.
With respect to francophone and anglophone applications, we’ve been able to reduce that gap. It was about 15 weeks two years ago. It’s down to about 8 weeks. In the last quarter that we’ve been able to monitor — Q3 for this year — the gap was 2.4 additional weeks of wait time for francophone applications versus anglophone applications. It will take a bit of time for us to make that one even. We’ve hired more bilingual civil servants to be able to help us with that. It’s specialized work that involves nurse adjudicators and things of that nature. We have to get them trained, so we’ve hired additional people to help reduce that gap right now.
Senator Pate: Will that data be updated as well by your department?
Mr. Harris: We publish it every quarter, actually, on our website.
Senator Pate: Now for my unsolicited advice. You have incredible workers who assist folks to walk through an incredibly overburdened, complex series of requirements to meet for veterans to obtain benefits. The very helpful people often can’t put that information in and you have many veterans — and even their children, sometimes, who are not as technically proficient as they would like to be — trying to enter that information. It strikes me a way to streamline some of that would be to provide more opportunities for those workers to actually do the onboarding, which happened during the pandemic but has now been phased out again, in my experience. That’s just an unsolicited suggestion from someone who’s trying to assist several veterans. Thank you.
The Deputy Chair: No comment?
Mr. Harris: I’m happy to answer, Mr. Chair. I think it’s an excellent suggestion. It is exactly what we’re working on, namely, making things easier. Earlier, Senator Smith asked the question about automation and AI. We’re trying to make all the applications easier in that ensuring, if you can actually go on and use the website, that we don’t allow you to proceed to the next stage unless you give the information that’s required. Making sure people are filling out complete applications and giving us all the information we need to make decisions more quickly.
Similarly, it is about reaching out and ensuring that we have opportunities, either through Veterans Affairs or through people who work for the Royal Canadian Legion, also known as the legion. The legion and service officers also help veterans and their families prepare applications for us. There are other elements and other organizations that help, too. We want to make sure they’re empowered to help veterans and we want to ensure we’re working directly with them and their families to make sure they can get us all the information we need to render a decision quickly.
The Deputy Chair: We are at the end of the first round. We have been so efficient with the time, so I will be more flexible in the second round — more, but not too much more.
Senator Marshall: Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. My first question is for Global Affairs.
There is a loan there for $201 million. It’s non-budgetary; it doesn’t get back to the deficit. It was there last year also. Could you tell us something about that loan? To whom is it? What are the terms? Do you expect it to be repaid?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you, Senator Marshall, for your question. Yes, we do have that special authority in that it’s for a loan to other countries so that they can invest in their own country to reduce poverty and ensure higher prosperity. Those loans tend to be given with a concession, namely, that the percentage of interest is low and there is a schedule of repayments. We offer those types of loans to countries where we want to make sure there is a return so that they will be able to reimburse us.
Senator Marshall: Okay, thank you.
Could you provide to the clerk the list of countries and the schedule of repayments? You’re saying that these are developing countries, so what is the likelihood of being repaid? It’s there as non-budgetary, which means the government expects to be repaid, but that might not necessarily be the case.
For that reason, I’d like to see the list of the countries and the schedule for repayment; that would be very helpful.
Ms. Ouellette: My colleague Geneviève Brown could answer right now.
Senator Marshall: That would be great.
Ms. Brown: Thank you.
Right now, one of the countries we’re currently negotiating with that has already been signed and we’re finalizing the deal with Jordan. Minister Sajjan signed that deal about a month ago, maybe.
The conditions of being able to provide a sovereign loan — a country-to-country loan — require us to look at solvability, their loan-debt schedule and their ability to pay us back. In this case, we did go forward with Jordan. Other countries that are under consideration that we have not yet gone forward with for the 2023-24 fiscal year are countries like South Africa and Costa Rica.
We’re not looking at low-income countries, for example; we’re looking at countries that are able to repay. It’s very much a condition of the program.
Senator Marshall: If the loan to Jordan has been finalized, how much is that loan?
Ms. Brown: Each of the loans under this program is up to a maximum of $120 million.
Senator Marshall: There was $201 million last year, and there is $201 million again this year. So that might be four countries if they were all getting $120 million.
Ms. Brown: That’s exactly right.
Senator Marshall: Do I have time for another question?
The Deputy Chair: Just 35 seconds.
Senator Marshall: Okay.
This is for both departments: Could you send us something that would indicate information as to how much is in the Main Estimates for professional and special services for each department? That’s been a controversial issue lately. It would be very helpful, thank you.
Senator Gignac: I learned so much when Senator Marshall asked questions to Global Affairs. Therefore, I want to offer some time to Senator Marshall if she wants to ask additional questions.
Senator Marshall: Thank you.
Can you give me that information on special and professional services now? Does the department have that? My information says it was $394 million last year. I don’t know if that figure is right, but I wonder what it’s going to be in the Main Estimates. The same goes for Veterans Affairs. My information says it was $581 million, and I’m wondering what is in the Main Estimates this year.
Ms. Ouellette: Last year, in terms of professional services, we spent $335 million. Previous years, on average, are around the $330 million mark, mainly around protection services and information services. Those are the big items from professional services.
Senator Marshall: How much for this year?
Ms. Ouellette: How much for this year? I will need to look. . . .
Senator Marshall: You can send it in, that’s fine.
Perhaps Veterans Affairs can give me a quick answer.
The Deputy Chair: Can I put your name down for a third round?
Senator Marshall: Sure. I would just like Veterans Affairs to get the information on that, and I’ll pick it up in the third round. Thank you to my colleagues.
Senator Loffreda: For Global Affairs Canada, there is a grant in the estimates of close to $2.9 billion for international development assistance for multilateral programming, which we’ve discussed. That represents about 38% of your overall budget in the Main Estimates for 2023-24.
I’m particularly interested in the department’s work with multilateral banks. As noted in your departmental plan, Global Affairs will:
. . . continue with multilateral development banks on the implementation of Canada’s current and past climate finance commitments, including through climate finance facilities at the . . . Asian Development Bank, African Development Bank —
— to name but those two.
More precisely, what work is the department doing to catalyze private-sector investments into climate-change mitigation and adaptation projects in developing countries? How successful have you been so far in attracting capital, and can you give us some specific examples?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for the question. Again, I’ll turn to Geneviève Brown to answer.
Ms. Brown: Thank you for the questions.
In terms of working with the multilateral development banks, the experience across many donors, not just in Canada, has been that the best way to work to mobilize private capital for climate has been through the MDBs because they are most able to do the geographic scope and work with supporting access to that funding. It is something we are working with them on. We work closely with our colleagues in Finance and Global Affairs Canada who work directly with the multilateral development banks. We will continue to do that.
In terms of how successful we’ve been in mobilizing private capital, one of the lessons that we have drawn over the last year, whether it’s been for climate or in our other program, blended finance, has been — and this is echoed across lessons that are not just in Canada — challenging to find the right mix to de-risk the deals to attract the private sector to some of the work that we’re done. I think we’ve been very successful in clean tech, for example, because there’s a very clear profit line that is more evident and less risky to bring the private sector along. That’s where we’ve been developing all kinds of different ways of working with the MDBs and structuring the deals to look at what roles Canadian funding can play. We put a particular focus, of course, on the gender equality aspect in respect of our feminist policy.
One of the examples I can cite within the Main Estimates today is the Green Climate Fund, or GCF, which is an important contribution that we’re making under the Paris Agreement. Of course, some of the work the Green Climate Fund is aiming to do is helping at least 10 million people in the poorest, most vulnerable countries adapt to the effects of climate change. In our work with the GCF is to target how Canada wants to prioritize some of those initiatives.
I hope that answers the question.
Senator Loffreda: Thank you. I’ll go on a third round.
Senator Pate: My question is once again for Veterans Affairs.
The 2022 Auditor General report on chronic homelessness highlighted that veterans are a particularly vulnerable subpopulation of that group. As we know, that became worse during the pandemic for many.
Also, the CMHC was not able to confirm whether their efforts had improved housing outcomes for veterans experiencing homelessness.
Part of your departmental plan is to support those initiatives and to support the implementation of the veterans homelessness program that was announced in Budget 2021-22.
I’m curious what your department is doing to ensure this issue is addressed, particularly in light of the fact that the departments that have the key responsibility don’t seem to be able to report on it. When I looked at your ombudsperson report and your appeals, except from 2018, there has been nothing since then about this issue.
Could you provide the latest data on this in terms of homelessness, and what efforts are being made, how are you tracking and do you have disaggregated data on who is homeless by gender, race and age?
Mr. Harris: Thank you very much for the question. We have been tracking veteran homelessness for a number of years. There are a variety of ways of doing that. There are point-in-time counts that exist from some of our partner departments and there is us working directly with homeless shelters and other organizations across the country to get a sense of what they’re seeing in terms of veteran homelessness. We do additional work with third-party organizations that have an interest in that. Most recently, some organizations like VETS Canada, Homes For Heroes and a number of other organizations have set up temporary housing for veterans. There are homeless shelters targeted specifically to veterans as well. We work directly with them.
Our intention first and foremost is always to prevent homelessness and ensure that any veteran who has a requirement for support — be it financial or for medical purposes — is getting the support they need, which prevents instances of homelessness. The numbers and figures have varied. It’s somewhere between 2,000 and 5,000, depending on the report, over a great many years.
We have a couple of benefits in place that help support veterans at risk of homeless or who are homeless. There is the Veterans Emergency Fund that allows for funding of up to $2,500. In exceptional cases, funding up to $10,000 is available for veterans who may be at risk of homelessness or facing other kinds of emergencies. We also have a Veteran and Family Well-Being Fund, in which we support homelessness-based organizations that deliver specific programming for veterans in various areas of the country. So we continued to do that.
As well, as the senator noted, there are announcements in Budget 2021 and Budget 2022 around rent supplement initiatives. We’re working with colleagues around what the delivery of that could look like as it comes forward. There will be more information to follow on that.
Senator Pate: Do you have disaggregated data at all?
Mr. Harris: We have some data. We have data in our own system with markers of homelessness for our own clients. Of course, there are also veterans who are homeless and who aren’t our clients at this point. That’s part of the initiative in terms of outreach. We work with these various organizations who have the capacity to go into areas where Veterans Affairs staff can’t and identify veterans. That’s why we work with homeless shelters in particular and share information with them about Veterans Affairs programs and services. We do it so that when they do an intake on a homeless individual coming into a shelter, they ask questions about whether they have military service or a military background. That will open up other avenues for support and funding. We’re doing that individually with organizations and collectively across the country on that front. We have some data on it, and we’re looking at how homelessness affects women veterans or LGBTQ veterans differently than other veterans. We’re looking to have targeted support for those areas as well.
We can provide the committee with the information we have on the contingent of homeless veterans at the moment.
Senator Pate: That would be much appreciated. Thank you.
Senator Duncan: My questions are for Global Affairs. I would like to follow up on grants and scholarships. First of all, could I have an explanation on the grant for the Global Arctic Leadership Initiative. What it is all about and what is its connection with the whole-of-government approach that we often see referenced in mandate letters?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for the question. I’m sorry, I don’t have the answer in front of me, so I’ll need to get back to you. Yes, there’s a grant. I think it’s around $12 million, but I’ll need to get back to you with the details.
Senator Duncan: Thank you.
Transport Canada and Global Affairs Canada have, it appears, either a competitive process or joint management of the million-dollar scholarship/charity program in memory of victims of two different international air disasters. I’m wondering why that couldn’t have been coordinated in one department. It’s a very important and worthy cause, but why is it spread across two different departments?
Annie Boyer, Director General, Financial Planning and Management and Deputy Chief Financial Officer, Global Affairs Canada: Thank you, Mr. Chair, for the question. I don’t know exactly why it’s been separated between two departments, but it’s related to the Iran — the PS752 event. There was a scholarship established following that event. I don’t have the answer for why it’s been separated between two departments, but we can come back to you.
Senator Duncan: Perhaps you can tell me how it’s working.
Ms. Boyer: I don’t have the details of the establishment of the program from that perspective. I’m sorry. However, I would be pleased to come back to you with an answer.
Senator Duncan: Thank you so much. I appreciate that.
Senator Galvez: Thank you, Senator Loffreda, because my question will just follow what you were talking about, which is multilateral banks. I was in Washington just a few weeks ago and had the opportunity to visit the Canadian offices at the World Bank and the Inter-American Development Bank. We talked a lot about assisting with infrastructure and adaptation to climate change in developing countries.
My question is the following: When we provide funds to these multilateral banks, do we provide just funds, or do we also provide guidelines and criteria in order to have a selection procedure for whom we’re helping and why we’re helping them?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you, Senator Galvez, for your question. Again, I’ll turn it over to Geneviève Brown.
Ms. Brown: Thank you. When we provide funds to multilateral development banks, or MDBs — regardless of which ones under the climate finance program — we very much have to ensure we’re meeting the thematic priorities and that we respect the Feminist International Assistance Policy, because those are all still part of the guiding framework of the funding decisions. That is very much part of what goes into the negotiations. Before we provide this funding to the MDBs, we ensure we’re able to speak to the gender equality priorities we want to see. We’re also increasingly pushing for greater proportions of adaptation considerations and how we’re looking at this.
It isn’t just a matter of providing the funds. We are very much respecting the guidelines and procedures that we require for our funding. What often comes with that is additional funding for technical assistance, which means we’re coming outside of the loan program to look at how we can support applicants who are trying to work with these programs and how to increase the visibility of the gender equality portion and gender employment. When we provide the funding framework, all kinds of pieces come along with it.
Senator Galvez: Where can I find all of what you just said? Is there a website?
Ms. Brown: There is a website that provides information about the projects that are being put forward both through Global Affairs Canada and Environment and Climate Change Canada. But I’m happy to provide that for you in writing.
Senator Galvez: Thank you so much.
What is happening in the Arctic worries me a lot. I was part of a research centre study on the Arctic, and I know that any research we do in the Arctic has to be international because it’s so vast — so huge. Many people are present in the Arctic with the right to be present, and we also have people who don’t necessarily have the right to be present but want to be present.
I see we gave grants to the Global Arctic Leadership Initiative, but we also gave contributions. Can you please explain to me the differences between a grant and a contribution? Do we have a list of countries that have access to these grants and contributions?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for the question. I missed the last part, sorry.
Senator Galvez: You can send it in writing, but it’s about the difference between grants and contributions with respect to contributions to the Global Arctic Leadership Initiative.
[Translation]
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for your question. I can give you those details regarding the grants and contributions for the Arctic. If you don’t mind, I’m going to explain the difference between a grant and a contribution in French to make sure I use the right terminology.
A grant is an unconditional transfer payment. This means that the payment is made once the information provided by the recipient has been assessed and it has been determined that they meet the eligibility requirements. The recipient provides reasonable assurance that the grant will be used for the intended purpose. Grants usually go to well-established, financially sound organizations with financial structures in place and a recognized ability to deliver programs.
A contribution is a conditional transfer payment, providing financial support for an eligible recipient proposal that has been approved. Contributions tend to be used when it’s deemed necessary to monitor results and performance more closely, and to obtain an accounting of how the funds have been used. The level of accountability is based on the level of risk. With a contribution, we also have the ability to audit the recipient or evaluate their performance.
Broadly speaking, that’s the difference between a grant and a contribution.
[English]
Senator Boehm: Ms. Ouellette, your minister made an important policy statement about Canada’s focus on the Indo-Pacific region, in fact, the Indo-Pacific Strategy. The committee would benefit if you could tell us how the Indo-Pacific Strategy figures in these Main Estimates. I note that you have the assistant deputy minister responsible beside you, but it is up to you.
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you, Senator Boehm, for the question.
As of now, they are not yet funding into the Main Estimates because we are in the midst of preparing the Treasure Board submission to be presented this spring.
Senator Boehm: There’s nothing in here in anticipation?
Ms. Ouellette: Not yet. As you know, through the supplementary process, we are seeking funding for that. Then I can turn it over to my colleague to explain the pillars and the activities that we intend to present. Thank you.
Weldon Epp, Assistant Deputy Minister, Indo-Pacific, Global Affairs Canada: Thank you for the question. Mr. Chair, I’ll start with a brief description of where we’re going with the capitalization of this strategy, and then turn it back to the senator.
As my colleague mentioned, the intention is to, through Supplementary Estimates, bring online new reference levels for what the government announced at about $2.3 billion worth of new resources to step up Canada’s long-standing engagement in the Indo-Pacific region but in new ways, with a new tool kit and new capacity across the five pillars.
The five pillars are in the area of peace, security; resilience, in terms of increasing trade and supply chain security; third, investing in and connecting people, including with the partner departments like IRCC, supporting a green, sustainable future; then, last, enabling Canada to be more present and active in the region as a partner. Those are the broad lines.
Senator Boehm: Ms. Ouellette, you mentioned in your statement the issue of consular and help for Canadians abroad. I’m wondering whether the $68 million that is identified, is this solely for modernizing the consular reporting program, or are there other elements in there in terms of services that your department can provide to Canadians who might be in distress or need consular services?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you, Senator Boehm, for the question.
In the Main Estimates, compared to last year, we do have an increase. As we discussed before, this is to increase the capacity to provide better services and to modernize our system. That said, we do have what I call the regular business, where we provide services to Canadians.
The total amount in the Main Estimates is $67.1 million. Of that, $56 million is for consular assistance where we have another $11.1 million that is for emergency preparedness and our response.
We have, year in and year out, 119,000 cases per year when we provided consular assistance.
[Translation]
Senator Dagenais: My question is for the Global Affairs Canada officials. It’s about information Senator Marshall was looking for, and you can provide a written response.
First, I’d like to know how many lawyers make up the department’s legal service. Second, how much did you spend on outside legal fees? Third, could you provide the list of the 10 largest law firms you deal with and their fees for the past three years? You can get back to us in writing. I assume you don’t have all that information with you now.
Next, I’d like to come back to the costs associated with Canada’s involvement through the UN. Can you tell us the total cost to Canadians of Canada’s UN commitment? I’d like to see how the costs have grown over the past 5 or 10 years. Could you also include related expenditures on trips, accommodations and living allowances? Again, you can get back to us with all of that in writing.
Lastly, I’d like to follow up on the $1 million for the commemorations of the victims of flight PS752. The department spent $1 million, and I imagine that’s not considered a big expense, but I’m surprised to see that a private contractor was used to set up the scholarship program being funded.
Can you tell us who the contractor is, how much it’s going to cost and whether their compensation is in addition to the $1 million that was earmarked? Lastly, why wasn’t that work done in-house, using internal expertise? Again, you can respond to those three quick questions in writing.
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for your questions, senator.
We would be happy to follow up in writing with detailed information on the legal fees, our UN contribution and the private partner receiving the $1 million. Thank you.
Senator Dagenais: Thank you very much.
The Deputy Chair: I’d like to remind the witnesses that we would like your responses by the end of the day on April 12, if possible.
That concludes the second round.
[English]
Senator Duncan: If I could add to Senator Dagenais’ question to include the link with Transport Canada in the written answer, if we can have that on the record. Thank you.
Senator Marshall: For Global Affairs, the grants and contributions, it was $4.9 billion in the Main Estimates last year and $4.9 billion this year. The estimates to date, it must have been in the Supplementary Estimates (A) or (B), because it is not in (C) — I checked — it was increased to $6.6 billion. Do you have the information there as to what that was? It went up to $6.6 billion, but it’s gone back down to $4.9 billion.
Ms. Boyer: I can try to answer the question. Thank you for the question.
For sure, we need to add what we received in the Supplementary Estimates in the 2022-23 fiscal year. We didn’t have (A), but (B) and (C). For the details of these grants and contributions, we can provide that in writing. That is the difference. That is mainly explained with where we are at to date, including the Supplementary Estimates and the Main Estimates.
Senator Marshall: If it is not in (A), then it would be in (B) because I checked the Supplementary Estimates (C); I have it here, so it’s not there.
What is the difference? This is something similar to what Senator Galvez was saying. The grants and contributions, that’s pretty well specified, isn’t it, in some sort of agreement?
For the grants, what is the process? Is it the department itself that decides who is going to receive a grant and how much? Or does it go to Treasury Board for further approval?
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for the question. In fact, it depends on the amount. We do have a certain threshold where we need to go to the Treasury Board to seek the authority for grants.
Senator Marshall: If you could give me the level. That would be my last question. You don’t have it here?
Ms. Ouellette: No, because it depends on the type of programming.
Senator Marshall: I’d be interested in seeing that. Thank you.
Senator Loffreda: My question is for Veterans Affairs Canada. I am quite interested to learn more about your department’s three-phased plan to roll out the joint military to civilian transition, a process at each of its transition centres. The departmental plan indicates that implementation is already complete in seven centres across the country and that you hope to implement the process in the remaining 20 centres by March 2024. I think providing our military with the adequate tools and support to transition to civilian life is an important process. They’ve given so much, as you know, to our country and peace abroad, it’s only natural that we give back to them.
Can you further elaborate on the department’s military to civilian transition process and the findings from your transition trials that wrapped up in December 2021? What type of feedback are you getting from those who are receiving the support? And if there is time, any further comments on homelessness or mental health challenges among our veterans are welcome.
Mr. Harris: Thanks for much for the question. The transition process for our military is of key significance for them as they go through it, but also for us working with our Canadian Armed Forces colleagues. We work directly with the Canadian Armed Forces, the Department of National Defence, with respect to the transition process. What we’ve done is a number of things. First and foremost, we are co-located on all the bases. We join with Canadian Forces personnel in the transition centres, at the bases across the country. As a member starts to go through the transition process, they signal they have to leave or have to leave because of a medical release. We work with them and the Canadian Armed Forces support to make sure the entire transition process is smooth.
That’s early engagement from Veterans Affairs staff. As Canadian Armed Forces staff are continuing to help a military member through that. As the senator noted, this is an enhanced process. Before there was a lot of attention still placed on medically releasing veterans. While the recognition is they are critical and we need to make sure all services are in place for them, we also need to make sure all releasing military members have access to the same level of assessment and support as they go through that process. We do not want military members to leave the Canadian Armed Forces and not have the supports in place for them. From a Veterans Affairs point of view, that means early engagement. We provide a number of supports and services with respect to making sure that military members continue to have access to medical treatment and medical aid, that they either required during their service or that they will require post their service. We do assessments to make sure they have the rest of the capacities and competencies they need to be successful post-military life. That could be rehabilitation, an education program, access to mental health treatment, as the senator indicated earlier. There are a range of elements we’re doing working collectively.
As noted, there is a rollout of that professionalization of the release process across all of the bases, and we continue to directly with the Canadian Armed Forces on that.
With respect to mental health, I might quickly add, I noted in the initial speech or opening remarks that we added a mental health benefit. What we recognized was that with some enhanced wait times and delays in processing, veterans who are coming to us with mental health issues were forced to wait to get treatment. The government announced in April of last year a mental health benefit that allows immediate access to anybody upon application with a mental health condition for disability benefits. What that simply means is, if you apply to us while you are waiting for us to make the decision, you can have access to mental health treatment and services immediately for a period of two years, even if ultimately we deny your application, which happens quite rarely in the case of mental health. About 95% of mental health applications are approved. You have immediate access to treatment and benefits. In the course of the last year, we’ve had about 9,500 veterans who applied for mental health disability benefits be able to access treatment benefits immediately as a result of this program. What we’re seeing is them being able to access that support quickly. We’ve had about 35% of the people who have applied and been granted that treatment going out and using it.
What we do want to do is follow-up, as a new benefit, and see why the other veterans aren’t using it. Is that an issue of access? Is that an issue of geographic location? Is that an issue of the difficulty of finding a provider? We need to make sure that those people who get access to the treatment can go ahead and use it. That is the analysis we’ve done based on the first year of our program.
Senator Boehm: This is a fairly specific question, so I’d be happy with just a written response.
The Anti-Crime Capacity Building Program on the grants side, there has been a marked increase. It’s almost double. I’d like to know the reasons for this. Is that because the program is being expanded to more countries? Is it because partner agencies like the RCMP are more engaged? I would just be interested in knowing where that program is going, since it seems to be on an incline in terms of funding.
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you for the question. I will be happy to provide you with the information. Thank you.
Senator Pate: This is for Global Affairs. I note in the work plan and the document plan that focus on the importance of an action plan for reconciliation with Indigenous peoples is part of your focus. It includes working with national Indigenous organizations and rights holders to align Canada’s foreign policy with the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, as well as ensuring enhanced participation of Indigenous peoples in issues that overlap and impact them.
I’m curious, in your 2023-24 departmental plan, you mentioned you’re increasing your efforts to implement this action plan. I’m curious what progress you’ve made and how you intend to monitor that and who you’re consulting with as you’re developing this plan.
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you, Senator Pate, for your question. Unfortunately, I don’t have the answer in front of me, so I will need to provide you with a written response. Thank you.
Senator Pate: That would be great. Thank you very much.
Senator Duncan: My question is very specific. With respect to the grants and contributions for the Global Arctic Leadership Initiative, you’ve given an excellent explanation of the differences between grants and contributions. In your written response to the committee, could we have exactly where those grants and contributions are going? That’s the specific answer we’re looking for. Unfortunately, we didn’t receive it from a different department regarding where those grants and contributions are going. We got the explanation about grants and contributions again, but we didn’t get where the money was going. I just wanted to be clear that this is what the committee was looking for. Thank you.
Ms. Ouellette: Thank you. We’ll provide the information.
The Deputy Chair: Thank you. We will now conclude this meeting. I would like to thank all of our witnesses for appearing today. It is much appreciated.
[Translation]
Before we adjourn, I want to remind the witnesses to follow up in writing with the requested information. You all have a job to do. Kindly send your written answers to the clerk by the end of the day on Wednesday, April 12, 2023.
Senators, please be advised that our next meeting is scheduled for Wednesday, March 29, at 6:45 p.m. We will be continuing our study of the 2023-24 Main Estimates.
Thank you everyone.
(The committee adjourned.)