Proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on
National Finance
Issue 3 - Evidence - December 10, 2013
OTTAWA, Tuesday, December 10, 2013
The Standing Senate Committee on National Finance, to which was referred Bill C-4, A second Act to implement certain provisions of the budget tabled in Parliament on March 21, 2013 and other measures, met this day at 5:15 p.m. to give clause-by-clause consideration to the bill.
Senator Joseph A. Day (Chair) in the chair.
[English]
The Chair: Honourable senators, I call this meeting of the Standing Senate Committee on National Finance to order. We are meeting this afternoon to begin consideration of Bill C-4, A second act to implement certain provisions of the budget tabled in Parliament on March 21, 2013 and other measures.
We have heard from witnesses and from the other committees that looked into certain clauses and divisions of the bill, and we are now in a position to consider whether we wish to proceed clause by clause.
Seeing no objection, I will assume that we're prepared to proceed with clause-by-clause consideration. It is important for each senator to know where we are at any particular time, so if you have any difficulties just wave your hand and we'll explain to you where we are in relation to this process. It gets a little funny at times with all the different clauses as we move along.
In order to make this a little bit more organized, I'm proposing what I had proposed this morning, which is to deal with Part 1 first in its entirety, Part 2 in its entirety, and then we will go to each of the 19 divisions in Part 3.
Stop me at any time if you wish to make a comment. I will ask if we are all in agreement, and if I hear "no,'' then I will ask whether it can go "on division,'' and if it can go "on division'' that's fine. If anyone wants a hand count at any time let us know and we will have a hand count, and we will read out those who are entitled to vote at that time.
Senator Eaton: If we have observations, when would we put them in?
The Chair: If you have an observation as an individual, an observation about a clause, just when we're there. For example, there are quite a few clauses in Part 1. Tell me which clause it is in Part 1, so we have it for the record, and then you make your observation.
Senator Eaton: It mostly would concern one or two divisions.
The Chair: Yes, so you will do that when we get to that division.
Senator Eaton: Thank you.
The Chair: That's the same for anybody. If you want to go on the record, because a record is being kept of this, with respect to any division before we take the vote, that's what we would like you to do.
Are we ready to proceed, honourable senators?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Shall the title stand postponed?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: We will come back to that. We postpone it for the time being; that's agreed.
Shall clause 1, which contains the short title, stand postponed?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: I don't know why we put off clause 1. Why do we postpone clause 1?
Senator Buth: Until you decide on the title, how can you decide on the short title?
The Chair: That is absolutely right.
Why do we not like to do the title upfront? I guess it's because we might make some amendments throughout, and if we make amendments the title might not be appropriate. If the title isn't appropriate, as Senator Buth so cleverly pointed out, then clause 1 would have to be changed as well. That's the first time I've ever really thought about that. Thank you for that.
Is it agreed, with leave, that the clauses be grouped according to the parts of the bill as described in the table of provisions of Bill C-4? In other words, can we deal with Part 1 and Part 2 and then go to Part 3?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Thank you. Otherwise, we would have to go through each clause in Part 1.
Part 1 is entitled "Measures Relating to Income Tax,'' clauses 2 to 120. Shall Part 1 carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
[Translation]
Senator Bellemare: I have a comment to make on some of the clauses in part 1; at third reading, I want to echo the consensus of several Quebec partners concerning the abolition of the tax credit for labour-sponsored funds. I am going to present the arguments raised by the business officers of the venture capital corporations.
The Chair: Thank you; are there any other comments on this policy or others?
[English]
So that has passed, on division, and we have had that comment.
Part 2 is entitled "Excise Tax Act,'' clause 121 at page 158 to clause 124 on page 162, a fairly short part. Shall this part carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
Part 3 is entitled "Various Measures.'' We're going to go through these divisions one at a time.
Division 1 contains clause 125, which is at page 163, to clause 158, which is at page 172. Shall Part 3, Division 1, carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
I should have mentioned "Employment Insurance'' was the first one.
Division 2, Part 3 is entitled "Financial Institutions (Conflicts of Interest),'' clause 159 at page 172 to clause 166 at page 173. Shall Division 2 carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Part 3, Division 3, "Financial Institutions (Investments)'' contains clauses 167 to 173, pages 173 to 175. Shall Part 3, Division 3, carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Division 4 is entitled "Passports,'' pages 175 and 176, clauses 174 and 175. Shall those clauses carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Division 5 is entitled "Canada Labour Code,'' pages 176 to 195. I'll give the clauses and then I will ask for comment: Clause 176 to clause 203. Senator Eaton?
Senator Eaton: I would like to pick up on what you said in your speech, and I agree with you. I think this division and perhaps one other would have better been served had they had their own piece of legislation. I don't quite see this as housekeeping. I see this as separate legislation, so I would like to make an observation.
The Chair: Are there any other comments?
Senator Bellemare: I would like to make the same observation.
[Translation]
The Chair: Is it the same thing?
Senator Bellemare: Yes.
[English]
The Chair: Shall clauses 176 to 203 carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
We're now into Division 6, pages 195 to 207, entitled "Changes to the Canadian Ministry.'' I've forgotten what the changes to the Canadian ministry were. These are clauses 204 to 238. Shall those clauses carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
Division 7 deals with the Dominion Coal Blocks out in British Columbia, clauses 239 to 248, pages 210 to 212. Shall those clauses carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Division 8 is entitled "Reorganization of Certain Crown Corporations (Bridges), pages 212 to 216, clauses 249 to 269. Shall those clauses carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Division 9 is entitled "Financial Administration Act,'' clause 270 at page 216. Shall clause 270 carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Division 10 is entitled "National Research Council Act,'' clauses 271 to 275 at pages 216 and 217. Shall those clauses carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
Division 11 is entitled "Veterans Review and Appeal Board Act,'' clause 276 at page 217. Shall that clause carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Reducing the size of the board. Carried, on division.
Division 12 is entitled "Canada Pension Plan Investment Board Act,'' clauses 277 and 278 at pages 217 and 218. Shall those clauses carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Division 13 is entitled "Proceeds of Crime (Money Laundering) and Terrorist Financing Act, clauses 279 to 281 at pages 218 and 219. Shall those clauses carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Division 14 is called "Mackenzie Gas Project Impacts Fund Act.'' My recollection is that this was about $500 million. That is at pages 219 to 223, clauses 282 to 287. Shall those clauses carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Division 15 is entitled "Conflict of Interest Act,'' clauses 288 and 289 at page 223. Shall those clauses carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
Next is Division 16, "Immigration and Refugee Protection Act,'' at pages 224 to 229, clauses 290 to 293. Shall those clauses carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Division 17 is entitled "Public Service Labour Relations,'' and this is at pages 229 to 259, clauses 294 to 364. Shall those clauses carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
I am at Division 18, which is "Reorganization of Federal Public Service Labour Relations and Employment Boards, at pages 260 to 307, clauses 365 to 470. Shall those clauses carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
Last is Division 19 is entitled "Supreme Court of Canada, clauses 471 and 472 at page 307 — Quebec appointee. Shall those clauses carry?
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
There is a schedule attached. Shall the schedule carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Shall clause 1, which contains the short title, carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Shall the title carry?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Senator Hervieux-Payette: I thought it was at 5:30. I thought I was on time.
The Chair: I will give you a chance to vote on this. Shall the bill carry?
Some Hon. Senators: Agreed.
Some Hon. Senators: On division.
The Chair: Carried, on division.
Is it agreed that I report the bill back to the Senate without amendment?
Hon. Senators: Agreed.
The Chair: Carried.
Honourable senators, unless the clerk tells me something else, I think we've finished this job.
Thank you very much, Ms. Deraspe and Mr. Fleury. You've done a great job.
And thank you very much to the scribes and the translators. We appreciate your help in being here.
Thank you, honourable senators, all of you, for your perseverance. This is an important matter for the government and for the country and we've handled it well.
(The committee adjourned.)