Proceedings of the Standing Senate Committee on
Social Affairs, Science and Technology
Issue No. 11 - Evidence - November 16, 2016
OTTAWA, Wednesday, November 16, 2016
The Standing Senate Committee on Social Affairs, Science and Technology met this day at 4:25 p.m. to study the mandate letters of various ministers.
Senator Kelvin Kenneth Ogilvie (Chair) in the chair.
[English]
The Chair: I've been informed that there may be another vote in the house that could occur fairly soon, and we want to hear from the ministers for certain.
On behalf of the committee, I want to express our appreciation to Minister Bains and Minister Duncan for being here, and for Mr. Knubley to be here as well. I'm delighted to see him here, filling out the team for our meeting today.
With that, we will get underway. Minister Bains, I'll invite you to present, then I'll ask Minister Duncan and then we'll open the floor up to questions, if that's okay with you.
Hon. Navdeep Bains, P.C., M.P., Minister of Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada: Absolutely, and thank you very much for the invitation. My apologies for our tardiness. It's just some of the procedural fun that we're having in the House of Commons with the opposition parties, but that's democracy, and I think it's completely within reasonable grounds that they are allowed to have some fun.
Thank you again for this invitation. It really is an honour to be here at the Social Affairs, Science and Technology Committee.
[Translation]
I'm honoured to address this committee. I know that it has produced thoughtful reports over the years, and I look forward to working with you.
[English]
Much like the department that I represent, the mandate of this committee is broad and far reaching.
[Translation]
I'm pleased to highlight for you some of the recent accomplishments of our ministerial team. I would also like to acknowledge John Knubley, our deputy minister.
[English]
Minister Duncan, Minister Chagger and I have represented Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada for more than a year now. This department was called Industry Canada.
[Translation]
The name change reflects the important role that innovation and science play in stimulating economic growth.
[English]
Minister Duncan, of course, will speak to her role and mandate as Minister of Science momentarily.
The third member of our ministerial team, Minister Chagger, is working to drive economic growth in the small business and tourism sectors. Our government has also chosen to align all six of the regional development agencies, the RDAs as they are known, under one portfolio. The idea is to elevate their importance and make them part of our government's overall agenda for economic growth.
Over the past year, I have had the opportunity to travel to many communities across Canada. I can tell you that our RDAs are truly the boots on the ground. Policy comes to life at the community level, and that's where the regional development agencies operate.
Bringing the RDAs under one department has resulted in the alignment of priorities and best practices that can be shared and scaled up. After all, good ideas should not be the monopoly of one or two parts of the country. They should genuinely benefit all regions.
The focus of the RDAs include, of course, developing young companies, identifying opportunities for companies to scale up, diversifying regional economies, promoting clean technology and supporting indigenous communities. This alignment makes good sense and is consistent with our government's overall growth agenda.
We also now track their progress in each of the above-mentioned areas so that we can identify areas of success. If you measure it, then you can manage it. Where we need to do better, we will.
Tracking also allows us to see opportunities in innovation that have a more regional focus and to share those practices.
[Translation]
Because collaboration is an effective way to drive innovation.
[English]
In fact, collaboration, openness and transparency are core values of this government. The Prime Minister himself set the example by making the mandate letters for all cabinet members — which we're here to discuss today — public.
Over the past year, our team has worked hard to advance the priorities outlined in our letters. On my first official day — I must confess that I was a bit nervous after being sworn into cabinet — I announced our intention to reinstate the mandatory long-form census. That's because our government understands the value of evidence-based decision making, and I'm proud to say that Canadians agree with us. The 2016 Census resulted in an unprecedented response, 97.8 per cent of people responded. The information we have collected will ensure that we have the best available evidence to make financial, economic and social decisions that benefit all Canadians.
The Prime Minister has also asked me to lead the development of an inclusive innovative agenda. This agenda is our government's plan to drive economic growth by tapping into the ingenuity and creativity of all Canadians.
[Translation]
That's how we will create well-paying jobs for the middle class and those working hard to join it.
[English]
The first and most important phase in developing this plan was to hear from Canadians because, as you know, the government can't act alone, and Canadians expected meaningful results. I must confess, we had an extraordinary level of public participation.
Over the summer, we held 30 roundtable discussions and invited Canadians to visit our website and to engage with us on social media. I have personally met with more than 500 stakeholders. We heard three recurring themes from Canadians, and I want to highlight those quickly because I wanted to really say that these ideas that I'm discussing today don't only reflect my views or the government's views but they genuinely reflect the outreach that we have done with small- and medium-sized businesses, with academia, with industry and, of course, with civil society.
First, we heard about the need for more people with the right skills and experience to drive innovation. We need to do a better job of preparing people for a rapidly changing job market. University and college students should have access to more work-integrated learning. Meanwhile, people already working should have more opportunities for continuous learning.
We are also committed to making it faster and easier for Canadian companies to attract global talent. Remember, we want to be open to ideas, to trade and to people.
We have already started to move on this front and as many of you probably know and have read in the recent fall economic statement, we announced Canada's Global Skills Strategy.
Second, we heard about the need to harness emerging technologies to achieve big things. That includes targeting resources in specific areas to fulfill ambitious missions, such as fighting climate change.
Lastly, Canadians told us that it was important for this country to develop the next generation of globally competitive companies. In the coming months, those ideas will inform our government's work as we fine-tune our innovation agenda.
Our government has already taken some bold steps to drive economic growth through innovation, so I want to talk a little bit about that.
Budget 2016 allocated $2 billion to renew university and college campuses across the country. This once-in-a- generation investment will create good quality jobs, but it will also allow students, professors and researchers to work in state-of-the-art facilities. They will collaborate in specially designed spaces that support lifelong learning and skills training, and they will work in close proximity with partners to turn discoveries into products and services.
The budget also committed $800 million over the next four years to strengthen innovation networks and clusters. These investments will focus on enabling technologies in which Canada has the potential to show global leadership.
We also allocated another $500 million in the budget for the extension of high-speed Internet service to rural and remote communities. Remember, we want an innovation agenda that is inclusive and we want to make sure that we deal with the digital divide in some of our rural and remote communities.
More than $1 billion is being invested in the development of clean technologies as well. We're talking about technologies that are more energy efficient, have lower carbon emissions and promote a healthier environment.
[Translation]
Our government has also made it a priority to collaborate with other levels of government to drive economic growth through innovation.
[English]
In June, I chaired a meeting of my provincial and territorial counterparts. I must confess that it was a bit surprising. The reason I highlight that is because it was the first such meeting that had taken place in 12 years, the first time where I met with my provincial and territorial counterparts to talk about innovation and economic development. That meeting has set a new tone for constructive engagement. That spirit of partnership has resulted in the Atlantic Growth Strategy, for example, which was launched over the summer.
The strategy is designed to stimulate the economies of the Atlantic provinces. The region faces low economic growth due to a shrinking number of working-age Canadians, the result of a population aging.
Another historic result of our collaboration with the provinces and territories is a new internal trade agreement that we signed in principle, what we call the Canada Free Trade Agreement. This type of agreement was a generation in the making and a long-held aspiration for our federation.
The agreement is all the more significant for having been reached at a time when the rest of the world is talking about putting up more, rather than fewer, barriers to trade.
[Translation]
The Canadian Free Trade Agreement will provide an ambitious, progressive and modern framework for the free flow of goods and services within our borders. As a result, Canadians will benefit from increased choice and opportunity.
[English]
In the year ahead, my officials and I will work with Canadians from all walks of life to finalize and implement the innovation agenda.
We will also act on our commitment to reinforce the independence of Statistics Canada, as outlined in the recent fall economic statement. This is a commitment we made during the campaign. It was reflected in my mandate letter and is now something that we have clearly demonstrated leadership on in the economic update.
We will continue to work with our regional development agencies. Through them, we will make strategic investments that diversify and strengthen the economies of each part of this great country.
As well, we will continue to support key sectors that drive economic growth and innovation, and that includes the automotive industry, which employs more than half a million Canadians. There was a question today asked in the House of Commons and so this is a priority for all parties.
I'm pleased to note that some automakers have signaled their intent to make new investments in Canada. For example, General Motors announced a major expansion of its engineering and software operations in Canada. The company will also make Ontario its design headquarters for the car of the future. Not only are they making significant investments today to expand their mandate, but they are also saying Canada will be leading when it comes to innovation and creating the technologies of tomorrow.
Meanwhile, strong demand through the Automotive Supplier Innovation Program continues to point to opportunities for emerging technologies to be developed in Canada.
An equally vital driver of innovation in this country is the aerospace industry. I was speaking at the Canadian Aerospace Summit earlier today.
The Chair: Minister, I wonder if you would mind if I interrupt you for a second. We understand you are going to have to leave momentarily for a vote at five o'clock. I'd like to know if there is a possibility you could return after the vote? I see nodding in the background.
Mr. Bains: Minister Duncan and I would be more than glad to.
The Chair: Thank you. In that case, I'll allow you to continue until your assistants move you out of the room.
Mr. Bains: As I was saying, the aerospace sector is critical, and it employs over 200,000 people — and these are good-quality jobs. A manufacturing worker in the aerospace sector makes $1.60 for every dollar made by workers in other manufacturing sectors.
[Translation]
I'm pleased to report that it's been a big year for aerospace. A major milestone occurred when Bombardier was awarded type certification by Transport Canada. This is a necessary step for C Series aircraft to operate in Canada.
[English]
Again, I wanted to quickly close on the aerospace sector, Bell Helicopter relocated the assembly of one of its jets to Canada from the U.S. Pratt & Whitney, of course, has negotiated additional investments here as well.
As a government, we embrace a partnership-driven approach to innovation. We collaborate with the provinces and the territories, with our colleges and universities, with the private sector and the not-for-profit sector. The results we have achieved during our first year in office point to the effectiveness of this approach.
Mr. Chair and colleagues, I am proud to serve a government that listens to Canadians and responds to their needs, and I'm honoured to serve with you on behalf of all Canadians. I look forward to speaking in greater detail about our mandate letter. Thank you.
The Chair: Thank you, minister. I sense you are about to be ejected from your seats, so we will await your return. I understand that will be possible.
We're looking forward to hearing from you, Minister Duncan. We know you have to go, so don't delay.
Mr. Bains: We will vote and be back momentarily. Thank you for your patience.
The Chair: Be back as soon as you can.
Mr. Bains: You have Deputy Minister Knubley here. The arrangement is very simple. He will answer the difficult questions on behalf of Minister Duncan and I, and we will come back for the easier questions. Is that a fair arrangement? I'm just teasing. I'll see you momentarily.
The Chair: Colleagues, would you like to ask Deputy Minister Knubley some questions? I can assure you he's one of the most knowledgeable deputy ministers on the Hill in the whole area of economic development. It is rare to be able to get time with him under any circumstance, and since we have him here, it seems almost wrong not to continue.
Mr. Knubley, we'll allow you to use your own discretion with regard to the questions, but the floor is open. Senator Eggleton, would you like to put a question to him?
Senator Eggleton: Sure. I have a question or two that I could ask of you as opposed to the ministers. I'll save the ones I had for the ministers — the political ones.
John Knubley, Deputy Minister, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada: Good idea. Thank you, senator.
Senator Eggleton: The minister did mention something about broadband and investments in that area.
The Chair: Yes, $500 million. I was going to ask him that, too.
Senator Eggleton: This is fresh in our minds in terms of the report that we put out yesterday on dementia. We heard from people in rural and remote communities that this was something vitally needed for people who were seniors; there are more seniors in rural areas than perhaps in urban centres.
They generally stay at home — that's where their families are. But they need the ability to be able through telehealth or whatever to get the kind of information for themselves and for their families with respect to living with dementia.
So this is a particularly important recommendation in our report — recommendation 23, regarding broadband.
What is the schedule for that? How quickly can that get up and operating?
Mr. Knubley: This initiative was announced in Budget 2016. It is for $500 million. There have been consultations over the spring, and we are to launch the program late in the fall.
Senator Eggleton: This year or the following year? "Late in the fall'' only has another month to go.
Mr. Knubley: We are going to call for applications in December.
Senator Eggleton: Okay. So in terms of operationally —
Mr. Knubley: Sorry, we previously had our Connecting Canadians program, which was launched under the previous administration, in Budget 2014, as I recall. It was launched in July 2014. We extended coverage to up to 280,000 households, with an objective of five megabits per second across the country.
This program that we're now proposing to move forward with will be particularly focused on very remote communities and trying to get service to these remote communities in the North but also in other areas of provinces where communities are remote.
The Chair: John, could I come in on that specific note? As you know, I live in one of the extremely remote parts of Canada called Nova Scotia. I'm not too far from a university; I'm only 25 minutes from Acadia University. There is no general broadband service in the area, other than extremely expensive satellite service and so on.
I happen to be in a very fortunate position where I am because I have a direct line to a microwave tower and I can get access, but most of the people along the shore of rural Nova Scotia can't do that. Is this new $500 million going to deal not only with extremely remote areas but also try to continue to fill in the areas that the system doesn't yet cover in areas as I'm describing?
Mr. Knubley: It's not really done on an ongoing basis, but what we do is work with each province to actually map the areas of poor service. In each province, we work together to identify where the "remote areas'' to be identified are and how we will proceed.
In the case of Nova Scotia, we still have work to do in terms of how we're proceeding.
Senator Merchant: Can you tell me how this program affects First Nations communities? There are some remote communities. How does that benefit them?
Mr. Knubley: The idea actually in this particular case is to identify a specific list of indigenous communities. Part of the focus of this $500 million will be precisely on those communities.
Senator Merchant: How do you go about that, if I might ask? How do you identify them?
Mr. Knubley: Typically, there is a lot of work done on a technical basis. There are two ways. The first is we do the technical work with the provincial authorities and the providers in each province. We actually prepared detailed maps of broadband coverage and identify the gaps. The second aspect of how we develop the plan is we actually do a series of consultations. We did the consultations over the last three months, starting in mid-June.
Senator Seidman: I would like to focus on the minister's presentation to us. He said he had round table discussions, met stakeholders and there were recurring themes.
You heard about harnessing emerging technologies and targeting resources toward specific areas. Canadians said it was important for this country to develop the next generation of globally competitive companies. You get the theme I'm focusing on here.
The budget committed $800 million over the next four years to strengthen innovation networks and clusters, to focus on technologies in which Canada has the potential to show global leadership.
I'm really interested in this. I've been sitting through a study on another committee where we're talking about sustainable energy and global leadership, and we've heard repeatedly that there are challenges in moving from R&D to taking a product to commercialization on the market. This is an ongoing challenge in this country, but there are huge opportunities. There are huge opportunities, as we say, to show leadership, to develop the technology and to market that in the rest of the world.
So where are our strengths and weaknesses? How are you going to do this? There's a lot of reference to that in this presentation. What are the fields where we have the leadership, and how are we going to show that global leadership and develop that global leadership?
Mr. Knubley: Let me start maybe at the top. Again, the minister identified how we have been consulting on the innovation agenda. There were 30 roundtables. We engaged outside champions, if you like, not part of the department or not part of the government, to lead these consultations, and they took place over the last three months.
As we did this, as the minister identified, really three topics came out as the priority ones. We actually had six areas of consultation. One is talent. What we hear from every company that we sit down with is that they almost always start with the issue of talent and how there are issues of importance to ensure that we have people for, basically, the skills of the future.
What I would describe, in comparison to discussions in the past on innovation with companies, is that it is really noticeable how much emphasis is put on this talent issue and how important it is that they have the right people. I think I've learned, in this consultation, that innovation is as much about the people we have as it is about the actual products or processes that we are creating in terms of added value.
I think what's behind it is an aging population but also this issue of emerging technologies. So the first area is talent.
The second area is emerging technologies. I think what we all observe is that there are such changing technologies happening. Business strategies are having to change because of advanced manufacturing, robotics, Internet of things, et cetera. Companies are struggling, to some degree, in terms of the pace of change and what's required, and there are some opportunities.
The third area is growing companies. The evidence that we have is that Canada is actually quite strong at creating firms. This is true in the clean technology area as well. In fact, some of the data shows that we actually create firms more quickly than the U.S. Where we fall down, however, is in the growing of the companies to a mid-size and to a large size. Typically, the pattern — and you've heard it anecdotally — is that an American firm will come and buy the IP and take it back to Silicon Valley or whatever. I think we really do want to — and there's a great deal of consensus around this — do a better job in Canada, really trying to take our good start-ups and then grow them into this mid-size and larger size. I'll stop there. I know there were other parts of the question.
The Chair: Yes, there are. I think I want to get some of my other colleagues in, and then we can come back to flesh things out. I think you gave a good start on it.
Senator Raine: It's great to have this opportunity to ask you a few questions.
The Chair: One question.
Senator Raine: One question, all right.
How confident are you in the science of man creating climate change? I guess my worry is that this has been an issue that's been very polarized, and I know there are scientific opinions and scientific treatises on both sides of the issue. Yet, I don't think the proper debate has been had. It's degenerated from being a scientific debate to being one almost of zealots. I don't think it's healthy.
I'm very aware now that, with the new government in the U.S., we could put ourselves in a very precarious position if we go forward with the assumption of putting in place programs that will be expensive. It could really hurt our economy. So I'm wondering how you're going to deal with that.
Mr. Knubley: We are committed to using scientific evidence as the basis for moving forward on climate change initiatives. Minister Duncan will speak to that when she comes.
Senator Raine: Okay.
Mr. Knubley: I think what I'd want to point to is that, as a result of the Paris conference, the government has created four working groups. The one that's of particular focus for us in Innovation, Science and Economic Development — and Minister Bains is a co-chair with the provinces — that will look at clean growth, innovation and jobs. This is more about how we promote sustainable operations of firms across the economy, not just in the natural resource sector. I think what I have observed as a deputy minister is that many businesses these days are very interested in improving their sustainable energy practices, partly because consumers are looking for that. I think that's one of the things that we learned as we did our work with the provinces on clean growth.
The other aspect — and I think it refers to some degree to some of the aspects of Senator Seidman's questions — is how important clean technology is for Canada. And there are some very strong firms in Canada. Some of them tend to be on the smaller side and very export-oriented, and there is a business opportunity here to grow these firms and help them to take their products abroad.
Then maybe I would just end by saying I do agree that it is unfortunate if there is a polarized debate on this issue. I think there's some real scientific evidence that leads you to some reasonable actions around sustainable growth but also the other areas of the working groups of this government, which relate to mitigation, adaptation and carbon pricing.
Senator Nancy Ruth: I'm very interested in how departments use gender-based analysis. It's not a matter of doing a form; it's a matter of measuring the outcomes.
So given the excitement around the automotive, aerospace and clean growth industries, how are you applying gender-based analysis, and how are you measuring it?
Mr. Knubley: That's a great question.
Senator Nancy Ruth: I thought so.
Mr. Knubley: I think the way I'll answer it is to say that, first of all, within the department, there are processes around gender-based analysis, and we have really stepped up, if you like, the work that we do around this in terms of specific initiatives.
So as items come forward for consideration by ministers, we follow this process around gender-based analysis and make recommendations in that regard, but let me just try to address your very specific question. I think you will hear Minister Duncan, and would also hear Minister Chagger, talk a good deal about the importance of women in science, the importance of women in the STEM disciplines. When we move forward and work with, say, the aerospace sector or the auto sector, we are constantly engaging with the businesses around how to improve the training of the people in these sectors in a way that will be more responsive to gender equality.
Senator Nancy Ruth: My concern is that, for over 20 years, we've had the process.
Mr. Knubley: Yes.
Senator Nancy Ruth: But we haven't had outcomes that are favourable. We are still doing the process.
Mr. Knubley: Yes.
Senator Nancy Ruth: So how are you going to measure outcomes?
Mr. Knubley: Well, I think you would see that, in the individual initiatives, this government is generally very committed to metrics. I have actually created a new group in my organization to develop metrics around our activities in particular.
In this case, I would say to you that we are really trying to set specific outcomes related to women in science, the STEM disciplines and coding so that we can see results. I agree with you that it is frustrating that there have not been more results over the last 20 years.
Senator Merchant: I will ask a question about the census because Minister Bains mentioned that. Now that you've had one long-form census — you've had it reinstated — but I'd like to know if it has changed. Has the long-form census changed from the previous one?
Mr. Knubley: No, basically the Chief Statistician, in consultation with ministers, launched the 2016 census. Essentially, the questions in that census are, with one exception, I believe, the same as the ones that were in the previous mandatory census.
Senator Merchant: I see. Does that entail some extra cost to have the long-form census rather than the short? What kinds of results were you interested in that you weren't getting from the short-form census?
Mr. Knubley: I'd have to get back to you because I'm not sure about the costs related to the census. This is obviously the purview of the Chief Statistician.
Senator Eggleton: One item that's in both ministers' mandate letters is the establishment of new Canada research chairs to help foster the creativity that leads to cutting-edge research. This is the Canada Research Chairs for sustainable technologies, specifically. How is that coming along?
Mr. Knubley: The program invests approximately $265 million per year to attract and retain some of the world's most accomplished and promising minds. It's supporting nearly 1,700 researchers at over 70 universities across Canada.
What's been announced by Minister Duncan has been a new Canada Excellence Research Chairs competition. In that, and it goes back to an earlier question, she has strengthened the emphasis on equity and diversity. This competition is under way at this particular point in time and will lead to the appointment of new chairs in due course.
Senator Eggleton: So there haven't been any results yet, just these plans and the money allocated for it?
Mr. Knubley: No, typically the way this program works is funding is provided for a certain number of years. Each year, we typically look at the complement of chairs. We're looking at, I think, a complement of 10 to 15 chairs, and there's a competition under way to identify those people.
Senator Eggleton: You said "in due course'' decisions would be made as a result of the competition. How long is "in due course''? Are we talking about next year sometime until this gets moving?
Mr. Knubley: Again, it's a competition. We take time to look at who the real leaders are here that we want to appoint. We want to get the right gender mix, so I can't give a time frame on that.
Senator Eggleton: We also want to get it going.
Mr. Knubley: Just to say there are already a number of chairs in place.
Senator Eggleton: Yes, I know, but this is a promise they made in the election campaign as well as in the mandate letters.
Senator Seidman: Perhaps I could just continue my question, then — the parts you didn't have a chance to answer.
What are the strengths in this country? What are the technologies or the key growth sectors where Canada has the ability to attract investment, to grow into those mid-sized companies and then to take that global?
Mr. Knubley: Although this has not been confirmed, we are looking at a process where we're hoping that people, particularly firms within clusters, will come forward and present a value proposition to the government around how they will support clusters in a way that will be promoting an emerging technology, have strengths in terms of partnerships and collaboration, and really have a global presence.
The processes as envisaged will really be ones where we want businesses or organizations like Communitech or COSIA to come forward and identify what the gaps are that will need to be addressed.
Having said that, there are a number of areas where Canada is typically strong. There were, for example — although this is more on the pure science side — a number of announcements around the Canada First Research Excellence Fund. I will give you examples of where we have dedicated significant amounts of money to do fundamental research. My personal view is that it shows a number of real strengths for Canada.
So let me give you some of the list. The first is on the North and the issues at play in the North. The second would be quantum science and quantum technology. There were a number of awards that went to Sherbrooke, UBC and Waterloo. Global food — and you probably heard Dominic Barton talk about the strengths of Canada in the food sector and the opportunities for Canada to take advantage of the growing middle class in Asia. There's an award related to regenerative medicine and stem cell theory — lots of strengths in that regard.
There was an award for ocean technologies. If you look both on the West Coast and the East Coast this particular award actually went to Dalhousie, the University of P.E.I. and Memorial University of Newfoundland. However, I think there are also strengths in ocean technology in the West.
I could continue, but I think also artificial intelligence is another area that we are certainly hearing a lot about today. In Montreal and Toronto, there's real leadership in the area of artificial intelligence.
I could carry on, but I think there really are areas where Canada, in this world of fast-paced change and emerging technologies, has real strengths. The challenge for Canada is always to translate that fundamental science work that we are leaders in into commercial opportunities. We're hoping that the new design of the cluster program that we're talking about really does try to attack that issue of commercialization in the clusters and helps translate some of this fundamental science that we have just awarded money for to get to the market.
Senator Seidman: In the mandate letter of the minister —
Mr. Knubley: Minister Bains?
Senator Seidman: Yes, sorry. Under "top priorities,'' the second point is to:
Improve the quality of the publicly available data in Canada. This will require working with Statistics Canada, the President of the Treasury Board and other departments and agencies to develop an Open Data initiative that would consider big data and make more of the data paid for by Canadians available to the public.
Could you give me some idea of where we are with that whole project of open data and its availability to the public?
Mr. Knubley: Yes. Treasury Board is really in the lead on the initiatives related to open data. Our department is working very closely with them on this. We do work with telecommunication firms in the ICT sector on big data and the opportunities there. Again, this is an area where we're working together and hoping that we can actually translate some of the opportunities we have in the country from a business perspective to materialize and have some real commercial opportunities.
Minister Duncan would also want to talk about some of the support that we're providing the universities through CANARIE and Compute Canada. What we're doing there is reviewing their activities to ensure that we, again, are providing adequate support to universities in terms of their digital infrastructure.
Senator Seidman: So you're suggesting that I might ask Minister Bains more about this?
The Chair: We will move into that phase.
Mr. Knubley: Yes, I think that's a terrific thing to ask him about that.
Senator Seidman: How appropriate that the minister should enter at this very moment.
Senator Raine: This is an easy question.
Mr. Knubley: I was suggesting that Minister Duncan might want to talk to the issues related to Compute Canada and CANARIE.
The Chair: Given the way the afternoon is going, I'm going to get right back to the ministers, even though we have just had an absolutely great opportunity to interact with the deputy minister who, as you know, is one of the great ones on the Hill.
With that, Minister Duncan, I will invite you to speak to us.
Hon. Kirsty Duncan, P.C., M.P., Minister of Science: Mr. Chair, I want to begin by saying thank you. It's an honour to be here. I want to say thank you for the invitation. It's a special honour because I've had the privilege of working with so many of you over the last many years, and I want to thank you before I begin.
[Translation]
I'm pleased to be here in front of this esteemed committee. I appreciate the opportunity to speak today about my mandate letter and what is being done to strengthen science in our country.
[English]
I would also like to acknowledge my dear friend and cabinet colleague Navdeep Bains, Minister of Innovation, Science and Economic Development. And you've heard from John Knubley, and as you say, senator, he is one of the real special ones on the Hill.
[Translation]
Mr. Chair, last November, the Prime Minister asked me to take the lead on supporting research and on integrating scientific considerations into our policy choices.
[English]
As the Prime Minister wrote, support for science is an essential pillar in our strategy to create sustainable economic growth and grow the middle class. Boosting the role of science is certainly something about which I am passionate. For starters, we have made it clear that government scientists can and should speak freely about their work to the media and to the public.
Last May I worked with my colleague, Treasury Board President Scott Brison, on releasing a new government communications policy. The policy is clear: Subject-matter experts, including scientists, can speak publicly about their work without being officially designated to do so.
What's more, our government is breaking down the silos that prevent federal scientists from sharing their knowledge with each other as they advance common goals. To help accomplish this, I met with deputy ministers from science-based departments and agencies at a first-ever retreat this summer. I stressed to them the need to promote greater integration across portfolios, and I am very encouraged by our progress to date on human resources, on labs and infrastructure, and on IT.
[Translation]
We are also making real investments that will improve federal scientific capacity.
[English]
For example, last May I worked with the Minister of Fisheries to announce a $197 million investment that will help us make more informed decisions about our oceans, waterways and fisheries. That same investment is creating 135 new jobs in federal science, the single largest recruitment ever toward restoring ocean science.
And to ensure federal science is fully available to the public, we will be establishing a chief science officer position. We will launch this search in the near future.
[Translation]
Mr. Chair, science is essential to Canada's Innovation Agenda.
[English]
And the ability of our country to compete and prosper depends on the creativity and talent of its people. To that end, in June I launched a panel review of federal support for science to ensure the funding we provide is strategic, effective and meets the needs of our scientists. I expect to receive the panel's recommendations by the end of the year.
We are also promoting increased collaboration between researchers and companies, and we're encouraging more co- op and internship opportunities.
At the same time, we have rolled out a number of funding initiatives to boost our academic strengths. These include, as you heard from my colleague, Minister Bains, $2 billion for research and innovation infrastructure across post- secondary institutions; $95 million top-up to the three federal granting councils to support discovery research, and this is the largest increase to the granting councils in a decade; $900 million for transformational research projects under the Canada First Research Excellence Fund.
In October, I also launched a competition for 11 Canada Excellence Research Chairs, at least two of which will be in clean and sustainable technologies.
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That is some of what we have done in Canada.
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In addition, I have taken part in several high-level meetings in China, Japan, Belgium and Germany to promote Canadian science and to see what other countries have been doing well and to build new science partnerships.
In September, I attended a White House Arctic Science Ministerial meeting. In all of these places people are eager to know about Canada, our vision, our openness and our plan for the future.
That plan involves creating opportunity for researchers, especially for women, indigenous peoples and other under- represented groups.
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Diversity is an important factor in the creative potential of individuals, organizations and nations.
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That is why we must absolutely take action to remove the barriers preventing women from pursuing careers in science. To this end, we have reinstated the UCASS, University and College Academic Staff System, which will inform policy decisions that concern university researchers and faculty.
Moreover, the Canada Excellence Research Chairs program has taken measures to increase the participation of women. And for the 2016 Canada Excellence Research Chairs competition, we have instituted new requirements that will strengthen the equity and diversity of the program.
Mr. Chairman, as we advance our innovation agenda, science will play a prominent role in our decision-making and investment choices. I look forward to building on the momentum of what we have accomplished in the past year.
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Thank you, Mr. Chair.
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The Chair: Thank you both very much for being part of this.
I'm going to ask a question before I get to the speakers list. I remind my colleagues we are now back on the original ministerial speakers list of which I have three on there at the moment.
I'm much more aware of the current developments in our basic research capability, Minister Duncan, and the outstanding research that we have in the country. Of course the great advantage of that research ultimately returns to our society when it's translated into social and economic development. So I'm going to ask my question on that to Minister Bains with regard to what you have been saying.
You have been carrying out all these consultations. You have met with a wide range of innovators and those involved in economic development. What I'd like to get from you is your sense of the nascent innovation that is occurring in this country, that is, the truly innovative ideas that are right at the move forward and implementation stages and the development of new business economic opportunities, new market access capability based on the tremendous science that exists in the country.
I wonder if you could give me some observation that you have to this point.
Mr. Bains: Sure. Thank you very much for that question. One of the points you raised in your remarks — I think it's very important, essential and consistent with the remarks made by Minister Duncan that when we talk about the innovation agenda, science is a key component, and the fact that we have to take pride in that. We represent roughly 0.5 per cent of the world's population, and we produce 2 per cent of the world's publications. We punch well above our weight. These are good-quality publications. It's one indicator, next to the amount of R&D we invest for higher education. We rank first amongst G7 countries. So science is a core foundation.
Under the leadership of Minister Duncan, we have put more monies into our granting councils. Of course, as I mentioned, we reinstated the mandatory long-form census. That sent a very important signal when it comes to our emphasis on science.
My focus has been on the commercialization aspect of it, as well as what you alluded to. That's essential, because too often the case is that we come up with the ideas, but we don't necessarily take advantage of that IP or that idea, and that idea is commercialized abroad.
A couple of areas stand out. I know my deputy talked about three key themes that emerged, and I referred to them in my remarks: the focus on people, talent and lifelong learning.
The other one is key emerging technologies. In that area, some horizontal platforms have emerged showing that Canada has a lot of leadership. One is artificial intelligence. That is changing and disrupting what's happening in sectors all across the economy.
The other one would be quantum computing. That's another horizontal technology that has a significant impact.
However, our government is putting a fair amount of effort and energy in the clean technology area as we move to a low carbon economy. We put forward a $1-billion fund in the last budget to reflect our commitment to commercializing clean technology, and we're seeing a lot of solutions emerging in that area. That can speak to, for example, ocean tech that's taking place in Atlantic Canada, stuff that we're seeing in agriculture and agri-food processing as well, and value added there. A lot of that is emerging in those areas as well, which is essential.
I was in India last week, and I can tell you right now that they have major challenges with regard to pollution. I was in Delhi, and it has the worst air quality in 17 years. It was really bad. When I was speaking to my counterparts, they wanted to tap into our investments in clean technology. So that's one area that's emerging which is very significant.
However, we can't underestimate some of the key sectors that already exist in Canada and that have a long-standing history, such as the auto sector. GM just announced 1,000 new engineers to develop software and technology for the car of the future. The aerospace sector has always been number one or two when it comes to R&D investment, and they have obviously produced state-of-the-art technologies. So the auto and the aero industries still tend to be very strong. We also see a lot of start-up companies emerging in Toronto and the Waterloo corridor in the information and communications technology, or ICT, and life sciences sector.
A lot of solutions are emerging, both small and large in scale, and we're seeing this pretty much prevail in all sectors. Technology is now prevalent in everything, from fintech to ocean tech to clean tech. The point that I want to highlight is the fact that artificial intelligence, for example, or quantum computing, is going to be the foundation for a lot of the commercialization and the technologies that will emerge.
The Chair: Thank you very much. I'm going to turn to the speakers list. My understanding is the ministers have to leave by 6 p.m. I will invoke the one-question-at-a-time rule and go around for as many opportunities as we can.
Senator Eggleton: We don't get to question each minister?
The Chair: No, one question. I will start with Senator Eggleton, to be followed by Senator Seidman.
Senator Eggleton: Thank you to both of you for your presentations. You have outlined a number of programs. You outlined a vision. You've said, "Here's money that's being applied to it, and here are all the meetings we've held to get there.'' Next time we would like to have you here to talk about outcomes and results, because we need it.
In terms of the things you've outlined, Minister Bains, it's very promising. But we have a weak economy, so we need some of these things to be in effect very soon, as opposed to somewhere down the road.
I'm going to ask you about one of the areas in your mandate. I have questions to pose to you, but next time I'll get to Minister Duncan.
One of the items is for you to support the Minister of International Trade and the development of programs to support Canadian businesses to increase their exports, expanding the range of their trading partners, and adjust to take advantage of and prepare for the implementation of new trade agreements. Similar statements came out in the platform that your party presented in the election campaign.
I think this is particularly important. I, of course, have an interest in this. Back in the day when I was Minister of International Trade, the Minister of Industry at the time, who was John Manley — we had, in fact, a joint operation of being able to encourage our industries to get into markets abroad, and beyond just the United States. We wanted to broaden our endeavours, and maybe that is no more needed than it is right now. Perrin Beatty certainly said that yesterday when he was talking about the kind of situation we're being faced with, with the new presidency in the United States.
The government has signed the CETA agreement in Europe. Just like all these trade agreements, there are numbers in there that say, well, we can have X number of jobs and we're going to have this much GDP, this much growth in the economy. But that's, by and large, if our industries take advantage of it. It's enabling. It's not going to automatically fall into our laps. It has to be pushed and encouraged an awful lot. We are a trading nation, and this agreement could be very important to us, so we really need the mechanisms to be able to encourage our industries to expand, to export into these other markets.
Tell me how you're progressing on this. Tell me what you're doing to particularly set up new — as it said in the campaign literature, "We will develop a new export promotion strategy that will help businesses take advantage of new trade agreements.'' So tell me, what have you set up?
Mr. Bains: Thank you very much for the question. I think you're absolutely right. When it comes to the innovation agenda, there have to be both short- and long-term aspects to it. I think some of the short-term provisions we put in our budget — the $2-billion strategic investment for our universities and colleges is designed to go into effect immediately. We launched that ambitious program. We rolled out the commitments for that, for example. So we have short-term measures in our budget as well.
Some of the ones that will take some time — and I know my deputy alluded to them earlier — are around the cluster network strategy, as we create those global centres of excellence. That will take a multi-year effort to see those gain prominence and be influential in terms of growing companies and creating jobs.
But this time around, when it comes to the innovation agenda, if I may, there are a few lessons learned. I spoke with the former ministers of industry that held this portfolio.
One element that's different this time is the inclusive nature. We're focusing on young people, indigenous communities, women and new Canadians, looking at the digital divide issue. I know you spoke about that with respect to broadband connectivity a few moments ago. That's different. We genuinely want to be inclusive, because if we're not, we see some of the social and economic challenges that are unfolding in other parts of the world with Brexit and what we have heard in terms of the U.S. rhetoric.
The other one is focused. We want to be focused in key areas. That's why we have three key policy planks in areas around talent, human resources technologies and focusing on high-growth firms.
We also recognize that it has to be a partnership-driven model. Government does not have all the solutions. We do a really good job when it comes to R&D investment. We rank number nine among OECD countries in terms of government support for R&D, but industry is falling behind relative to our peers. If you look at Canadian industry, we rank 22 out of 34 countries when it comes to R&D investment.
We need to unlock some of that cash off the balance sheets. What we're trying to do differently this time is how we genuinely engage industry, academia and civil society, because we need a collaborative model and effort.
Your point around execution is critical. To give you an example, we have a program called the Build in Canada Innovation Program, BCIP. It's an innovative program for first-time buyers for procurement. It's a $40-million program. The take rate is only $12 million. We do billions of dollars in procurement, we have carved out $40 million for first-time innovators, and only roughly one quarter of that gets used. That's a reflection of execution, so I think we need to do a better job in terms of how to execute better.
To your last point, we need to make sure we have clear metrics that are understood by the public that we can manage and communicate, and those metrics are around growth, jobs and R&D. We recognize that's key to our success. I wanted to give you some context. We have a short-term plan; we have a long-term plan. It's different than previous attempts. A lot of lessons learned, and we've been more engaging in terms of our outreach.
In terms of how we work with the mandate letter in terms of my colleague on International Trade, one example of that — and I mentioned it in my remarks — is the auto sector. We are focusing on getting investments from companies from other jurisdictions to come to Canada. Those investments will obviously help with the auto-sector mandate. We're creating a one-stop shop when it comes to auto investments, and we want to take advantage of CETA. We're telling companies, "If you set up shop in Canada, we not only have a North American Free Trade Agreement, but now — as you alluded to — we are in the process of ratifying and completing this free trade agreement with Europe, CETA.'' A lot of car companies are looking to Canada to be the hub from which they can export to Europe. That's an example — and there are many more — of how I work very closely with International Trade. We can sign all of the free trade agreements that we want. It's really about how businesses really take advantage of that. How do we genuinely allow our SME sector and some of our key sectors to really take advantage of that? That's something Minister Freeland understands and our government recognizes. Our Prime Minister definitely understands that, and this is something that he's championing on every trip he takes abroad. But that is a core focus. It's not simply signing agreements. We're going to demonstrate success by how we're really improving the export opportunities for our businesses. The auto sector is one example where we've become, I believe, in a very niche area, the point of contact for exporting into Europe for a lot of these auto companies. They recognize that, and that's because of CETA.
Senator Seidman: Mr. Knubley did a great job at answering my question regarding emerging technologies and the importance that you heard in your roundtables of Canada being at the forefront and being able to harness and develop the next generation of globally competitive companies, as you put forward here. You've started to touch on this again now in your response to Senator Ogilvie. We all know that this is a tough situation and has continued to be a tough situation in Canada, for whatever reason. Mr. Knubley mentioned moving from the small company to the mid-sized company. You mention, and we know, moving from R&D to the market and being competitive globally and, in fact, maximizing the opportunities internationally if we're innovators in particular areas. How do we maximize that internationally so that Canada and Canadians benefit from innovation, as opposed to Americans or Germans coming in, buying up the companies and then developing the technology? How do you intend to do that? Again, as Senator Eggleton said, how do you intend to measure that outcome? In science we measure outcomes, so how are you set up to measure your success?
Mr. Bains: We are absolutely about measurement and science. Minister Duncan reminds me of that all the time.
I totally agree with you. Your assessment is very similar to the approach we're trying to take. We recognize that we're really good at starting up companies. We start up over 70,000 companies each year. We really have become a start-up nation. It's a point of pride. It may not be the case across the country. There are different regions that have different challenges, but, overall, at a macro level, we're really good at starting up companies.
The challenge is the growth rate for highly capable companies that are able to grow at a high rate. The percentage is very small; it's roughly 3.5 per cent. The measurement I use is 20 per cent growth each year, for three years in a row. That's how I identify high-growth firms. That percentage is very small. So we, as a government, are trying to get better data to identify those firms. What we announced in the budget was an accelerated growth strategy, saying, "How do we identify those firms, use all of the different agencies and programs that we have, to help to navigate them through the different opportunities that they can have to scale up, to grow?'' That could be a reflection of grants and repayable contributions, initiatives for them to upgrade their talent, opportunities to improve the skillsets of their employees. That's one area.
The other area that I heard loudly and clearly from was businesses. And what we're going to do — and I mentioned it earlier as well — is procurement. The government can genuinely be a marquee customer. We can use historic investments that we're making in the purchase and acquisition of jets through our ITB policy, for example, our industrial technological benefits policy. We can look at the historic investments we're going to make in infrastructure as an opportunity to really engage Canadian companies that have really neat solutions and ideas.
What we're saying is we're going to set concrete targets. We're going to have targets for various departments. We want to look at how many firms we attract, and we want to do this through a very managed number of companies because, again, the high-growth firms are a very small percentage, 3.5 per cent. We're not dealing with hundreds and thousands of companies; we're dealing with a much smaller group. So we want to be very focused for them.
The idea is that, if you're a client or a company and you want to do business with the government, what we want to do is to present a set of challenges that we have and go out there to the market and say, "Here are the problems that we have; here are the challenges that we have in government. Does anyone have an innovative solution?'' It's not always about the lowest cost, but it's about the best idea. The hope is that they do business with us. It validates their particular solution. It allows them to go abroad and brag about the fact that they're doing business with the Government of Canada, which, again, creates more opportunities for them internationally. So that's an example of how we would create opportunities, and we would definitely measure that. Implementation, as I mentioned earlier, is the key to the success of an initiative like that.
Senator Merchant: Thank you, ministers. I'm going to direct my question to Minister Duncan. You've been sitting very quietly. You mentioned that you're going to appoint a chief science officer for Canada, and that you were just starting that process. I would like to know what the scope of his job will be, what function he will perform and how you're going to make sure that his position lives beyond the life of your government. Are you going to enshrine it in legislation? Are you looking at models in other countries? Which model do you favour? I understand that Quebec has a similar position. Are there other provinces that have this position? Are you working with the Quebec side to be sure that everything works well, that they complement each other?
Ms. Duncan: Thank you so much, Senator Merchant. Once I received this position, it was just weeks after that we began the consultations for the Chief Science Officer position. We want to ensure that government science is made available to Canadians, that government scientists can speak freely about their work and that scientific analyses inform decision making.
I began reaching out to the chief scientists, chief science advisors or chief innovation officers in different countries. That included Australia, Israel, the United Kingdom, the United States, New Zealand, and there were multiple meetings. Also, our officials reached out to one another, and then we began a broad consultation across the country. We reached out to the experts, the stakeholders and parliamentarians from across the political spectrum.
I can say that in the seven years I have been here no one has ever asked me for my opinion. I don't think one party has all the answers, so we reached out to everyone and asked, "What should the roles and responsibilities of this position be? What should the first actions they undertake be? How should they work with the external and the intramural science community?'' I'm pleased to tell you we've had over 80 responses, and the model that we will come forward with is going to reflect what the community has asked for. We even looked at the statistics. So we've really tried to reflect.
I can tell you that we hope to launch in the next very short while.
Senator Merchant: One part of my question was how you will be sure that this position lives on? Are you going to enshrine it in legislation, or what are you going to do?
Ms. Duncan: Thanks, Senator Merchant. You brought up the Chief Scientist in Quebec, who is Dr. Rémi Quirion. He's part of the review of fundamental science we have. He's one of the nine on that panel. We did reach out to Dr. Quirion. We absolutely want to ensure that this has durability and permanence. Those will be key issues for us going forward.
This is a really important position, and it's very unfortunate that this position was eliminated in the past. We want to ensure that it continues.
The Chair: I think that's probably where you're going to go.
Senator Nancy Ruth: Minister Duncan, I was delighted to hear in your speech that the plan involves creating opportunities for women, indigenous peoples and other underrepresented groups.
I'm actually interested in the work on climate change in Arctic marine ecosystems. I'm wondering what steps you can take given that research in that place to involve indigenous people, particularly indigenous women?
Ms. Duncan: Senator Nancy Ruth, you've asked about a whole batch of issues there. Would you like me to address women and indigenous people, and then move to the Arctic?
Senator Nancy Ruth: Whatever pleases you. It's a real problem. There are real problem areas.
Ms. Duncan: Yes, there are.
Senator Nancy Ruth: How do we do it?
Ms. Duncan: Let me give you some stats. Today in Canada, women account for almost half of the undergraduate science degrees in this country. It's a quarter when it comes to the engineering degrees. As you know, when you move up to the masters and doctoral level, it decreases. At the doctoral level, it's about 33 per cent of the Ph.Ds. Compare that to 49 per cent in the U.K. and 46 per cent in the U.S.
If you look at the science, technology, engineering and mathematics — STEM — workforce, in 1987, 20 per cent were women. Today, it's 22 per cent. No country can afford to lose half their talent. Science needs women and diversity, and science needs to be reflective of Canada.
I've been clear from the day I took on this role that I would make this part of my mandate. The action that has been taken to date is to bring back UCAS. Come April next year, we'll actually have data. Are women progressing through the ranks at the same rate as our male colleagues? Are they earning the same amount?
When it comes to these excellence research chairs, we've put in place equity and diversity. The universities will have to submit those plans, and they will be tied to how they've done when it comes to the Canada Research Chairs program.
If you look and the website for SSHRC, the Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council, the equity data is now available for across the country.
I want to add that we are leading on this internationally as well. I'm just back from China for the G20 science ministers' meeting and for the Carnegie meeting, and Canada worked with Japan to bring forward a motion. One of the areas covered was women in STEM, one of the three issues studied at these three days of meetings.
It's not just a gender issue; it's women, indigenous people and other underrepresented groups, such as those with disabilities.
You asked about the Arctic. Climate change is our most pressing environmental issue. As the world tries to keep from warming, it needs to stay to 2 degrees Celsius, which is associated with dangerous climate change. It's 1.5 now. Because we're a northern country, the warming is much greater. Some of those estimates are very high, and that's why you have this rapid melting of sea ice, as an example.
I was invited to the first ever White House Arctic Science Ministerial meeting. The perspective that I was proud to bring was that indigenous peoples need to be at the table, that we must work in partnership with indigenous peoples and that traditional knowledge matters.
My own research was in the Arctic. For a few weeks a year, we go up to the Arctic. Here's the example I'll give for why traditional knowledge matters: You go up for a few weeks and we've heard from the community, and the scientists ask, "Where do they bore into the ice? Where do they create that bore hole?'' The lakes aren't frozen anymore. This is traditional knowledge. When you live in the Arctic, you have to be able to read the sky and the atmosphere. You have to be able to read it. What they tell us now is that because of climate change, the knowledge they have traditionally relied on doesn't always match.
I'll finish with one last story. Years ago I was asked to give a lecture on climate change to a national indigenous group. I went and I said, "I hope you find it ridiculous I'm going to lecture on climate change. Instead could I ask you what the changes you have seen in the Arctic are?'' I could not write those changes down fast enough: "We've seen this insect that we've never seen before'' and "this is flowering four and five weeks earlier.'' I couldn't write down the changes.
I hope I've addressed your questions.
The Chair: Senator Raine, please speak efficiently and get an efficient answer.
Senator Raine: I've been interested for quite some time in the potential for nuclear power. There are lots of changes happening, and I'm just wondering what our program will be in terms of the education programs. I believe we're probably a little short of nuclear physicists and engineers in our universities and programs, particularly with the idea of using thorium, which I'm sure you're aware is a very interesting nuclear product.
Mr. Bains: On the science side of it, are you asking questions about whether we have specific grants or targets?
Senator Raine: I've been informed by people who have retired who are probably a fair amount older than I am that they are no longer studying nuclear physics in our universities. They're very concerned we're falling behind in our knowledge of nuclear energy.
Mr. Bains: I can definitely get back to you on the stats of where we are. The investments we've made into the sciences and the granting councils, for example, and the advancements we've made with academic institutions is all about creating an environment to allow individuals to pursue higher excellence in that area and other areas as well.
I'm not sure there are targeted initiatives associated there. I can definitely look into that. I'm not sure if my deputy has anything to add on that, but we can definitely get back to you on the stats.
The Chair: We would welcome you taking the question as it was posed. Also, please provide any information that your departments have with regard to Canada's position in terms of highly qualified personnel in this area and any changes that have occurred in the number of programs dealing with nuclear chemistry and physics in our Canadian university systems. There has definitely been a change over time. We'll let you get back to us with the official answer, if you could.
Mr. Bains: Absolutely. We'd be more than glad to provide that data and information. If there are any subsequent questions or follow-up, please don't hesitate to follow up with me or the office.
The Chair: Thank you. We'll have the committee consider that.
We really want to thank you both for being here. We know how hectic it is on the Hill; life on the Hill is certainly exciting on an ongoing basis.
With regard to a number of things you mentioned, as you're probably aware, this committee is about to undertake a study on the potential for artificial intelligence, robotics and 3D printing with regard to the health care system in general. It fits right into the "looking forward'' with regard to leading-edge kinds of issues. It follows up on some things we've done on the Hill, including one of my kiosk events, looking at supercomputing and big data capability. We'll follow that up with artificial intelligence in the spring as well.
Mr. Bains: On that, it's very interesting because I was speaking at the 2016 Canadian Aerospace Summit today, talking about the influence of the Canadarm and the implications on society. Health care is one area where robotics has had an incredible impact. It's very relevant to your upcoming studies, when it comes to additive manufacturing; 3D printing, as you alluded to and robotics. I think we have a lot of leadership there and it has direct application in the health care sector.
The Chair: We certainly have leadership in those areas. We're looking forward to getting it out and recommending it forward.
Thank you all very much. You've used some of the terminology that is clearly going to be the basis of successful societies and communities as we move forward. Hopefully, the programs that you will be coming forward with will be able to identify and promote Canadian individuals, Canadian applications and those nascent industries that will be the basis of the future economy. We are counting on you to bring that success forward.
We know you've had extensive consultations and we're really looking forward now to the application of that and the outcomes of those consultations.
With that, on behalf of the committee again, I want to thank you and wish you well in the matters you are tasked with.
(The committee adjourned.)